Brainstorm ways to reduce hackers
Comments
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BowDownToMe wrote: »So it's come to my attention that sending in replays is next to pointless because the hackers will just make new accounts when they're banned on their old ones.
That being said, if us as players want to have a nearly hack-free game, we need to help z8games figure out a way to get rid of the hackers, but not necessarily banning them. Z8Games staff spend hundreds of hours watching replays since they have no fast forward or rewind buttons either, so watching every replay is just... very boring and not proactive, really.
Don't suggest IP bans, they are already given and do not work because IPs change very often.
An idea I have that won't work:
CD-Keys: Buy a CD-Key for $1 and the amount of hackers will reduce to virtually non-existant, nobody wants to take the time or effort of spending even a dollar on a game just to hack it and possibly get banned. Plus lots of the little kids that hack can't pay over the internet (on the other hand kids could ask their parents to just pay a dollar, it's unlikely they'll do that if they're going to hack that may reduce the amount of players a little bit but they're not supposed to be playing if they're not 13 anyways).
This won't work because having to buy a CD-Key would mean the game is not F2P anymore, and that's what attracts almost everyone to it.
Another idea I have that may work:
Well it's not really my idea, but we should do what korea crossfire does (I'm pretty sure they do it, anyways), we should make it so that every crossfire account has to have a physical address they can determine with their Postal/Zip codes. I don't know how it works and I would think people could just give fake postal/zip codes, but z8games could so more more research and see how it works if that's actually how it works in the korean crossfire.
Don't post tl;dr, that's just spam and should be considered as such.
Please use constructive criticism for any ideas that people post, don't just say "that's a dumb idea", post WHY, and what could make it work, if anything.
I've heard the crossfire community sucks, but try to prove me wrong and don't troll :P
VIP server = people who have payed for this game won't have to deal with MOST hackers (because only 1% of hackers have bought ZP on their hacking account - i mean, why spend money and then throw it away??).
So it would be a virtually hack free server for people who have paid, while the game would still be F2P for everyone else who hasn't paid. it would just make playing a LOT more enjoyable for free players... -
yeah, but i mostly play with clan-mates or friends anyway, so it doesn't really bother me, and most hacks are easy as long as you are not on egypt or ship.
Agreed most hacks are easy to beat once you know how.
I play GM alot (3.2 KDR in it) and have learned how to counter most of them.
Speaders, If BL they make good target practice and as long as you don't stay still or move in 1 direction they'll have a hard time hitting you. As GR they'll get kicked very fast so its not a issue.
Chammers, If BL hardly any difference. If GR most of them lag anyways so forget b hop and zig zag run and jump instead. works very well with practice.
Instant defusers, Just don't plant the bomb. -
Playing against high pingers is double edge sword. On one hand they're easier to kill and don't require much to beat. On the other hand they easily have the most amount of QQers and are the most kick happy. (9 times out of 10 the one kicking me is a 130+ pinger)
The thing is, there's no effective way I can think of that would decrease the amount of hackers and still keep most of the player base easy.
True that compared to the average high ping, a low ping does much better. I don't even need to try to maintain a good KDR in a room with lots of high pingers.
i think that the current system of mixing good players and not so good players is the right way to manage the game. I think that in order to ban hacks, the clan system should be different. example:
If your clan has NO confirmed hackers, then everyone in the clan gets double GP from missions. I think this would make it impossible for anyone to hack while in a clan, thus reducing VIP hacks, as well as high level hackers.
while we are talking about changing the way rooms work, rooms could be ranked by the average KDR of the people inside it. then at least Nubs wouldn't join a room where the average was 2.5, if you wanted to take it further you could make the KDR average specific to that game mode. eg, if its a ghost mode room, then the average ghost mode score is displayed.
as far as ping limited rooms go. by making only a few ranges, more players are likely to join. although it is not the best for getting a perfect room every time, i would choose <100 and <200 as the only ping restrictions, if there were any more values, it think it would create the separation of the community into those with high pings, and those without. lets face it, 100 ping is not very much lag, and if you do like 99, then a little QQ might be OK, but otherwise, the guy had you killed anyway. less than 200 is generally playable with a few minor irritations, and more than 200 starts to get really annoying.VIP server = people who have payed for this game won't have to deal with MOST hackers (because only 1% of hackers have bought ZP on their hacking account - i mean, why spend money and then throw it away??).
So it would be a virtually hack free server for people who have paid, while the game would still be F2P for everyone else who hasn't paid. it would just make playing a LOT more enjoyable for free players...
would surveys be included? i know a lot of really pro people who only do surveys, and most of the ZEEPEE users are 10 year olds whose parents buy it for them, i would be careful what you wish for. -
Kragerzr76 wrote: »The ping limited servers should be higher than 150,such as 200 and up.Not 150,lots of legits play like this.I suggest paying for accounts.Get 1 free the rest you pay 5 dollars.
this makes me realize that VATAV and i have been posting a lot, so for those of you who didn't read it all, because it was so long
Ping limited servers are not the best solution
Ping limited ROOMS might be a better option
Ping is something that might be harder to hack than normal game files
The only way to ABSOLUTELY catch hackers is to have server side processing devoted to the task. -
i think that the current system of mixing good players and not so good players is the right way to manage the game. I think that in order to ban hacks, the clan system should be different. example:
If your clan has NO confirmed hackers, then everyone in the clan gets double GP from missions. I think this would make it impossible for anyone to hack while in a clan, thus reducing VIP hacks, as well as high level hackers.
while we are talking about changing the way rooms work, rooms could be ranked by the average KDR of the people inside it. then at least Nubs wouldn't join a room where the average was 2.5, if you wanted to take it further you could make the KDR average specific to that game mode. eg, if its a ghost mode room, then the average ghost mode score is displayed.
as far as ping limited rooms go. by making only a few ranges, more players are likely to join. although it is not the best for getting a perfect room every time, i would choose <100 and <200 as the only ping restrictions, if there were any more values, it think it would create the separation of the community into those with high pings, and those without. lets face it, 100 ping is not very much lag, and if you do like 99, then a little QQ might be OK, but otherwise, the guy had you killed anyway. less than 200 is generally playable with a few minor irritations, and more than 200 starts to get really annoying.
would surveys be included? i know a lot of really pro people who only do surveys, and most of the ZEEPEE users are 10 year olds whose parents buy it for them, i would be careful what you wish for.
1. "If your clan has NO confirmed hackers, then everyone in the clan gets double GP from missions. I think this would make it impossible for anyone to hack while in a clan, thus reducing VIP hacks, as well as high level hackers."
This won't make it impossible to hack, nothing is stopping them.
and once a hacker is confirmed there account is banned anyways (they just make a new account )
so all this does is increase the amount of GP rewarded for missions for clans that have never had a hacker in them.
2. "while we are talking about changing the way rooms work, rooms could be ranked by the average KDR of the people inside it. then at least Nubs wouldn't join a room where the average was 2.5, if you wanted to take it further you could make the KDR average specific to that game mode. eg, if its a ghost mode room, then the average ghost mode score is displayed."
Nubs are nubs because they refuse to learn how to play the game or anything about the game, they'll most likely ignore any form of KDR display and join anyways.
3. "as far as ping limited rooms go. by making only a few ranges, more players are likely to join. although it is not the best for getting a perfect room every time, i would choose <100 and <200 as the only ping restrictions, if there were any more values, it think it would create the separation of the community into those with high pings, and those without. lets face it, 100 ping is not very much lag, and if you do like 99, then a little QQ might be OK, but otherwise, the guy had you killed anyway. less than 200 is generally playable with a few minor irritations, and more than 200 starts to get really annoying."
Reasonable, and I've played with stable 120 ping before, other then having to aim about 5 feet ahead of my target it wasn't that hard. -
this makes me realize that VATAV and i have been posting a lot, so for those of you who didn't read it all, because it was so long
Ping limited servers are not the best solution
Ping limited ROOMS might be a better option
Ping is something that might be harder to hack than normal game files
The only way to ABSOLUTELY catch hackers is to have server side processing devoted to the task.
"Ping limited servers are not the best solution" Don't know for sure myself.
"Ping limited ROOMS might be a better option" Won't solve the hacking issue, but a useful feature.
"Ping is something that might be harder to hack than normal game files" I know for fact the only way to get around it is to hack the server itself. And who would hack a server just to play with a hack?
"The only way to ABSOLUTELY catch hackers is to have server side processing devoted to the task" The problem isn't catching them, it's there sheer numbers and inability to stop them from starting again from scratch.
Edit: just noticed I doubled posted, I'm tired XD -
1. "If your clan has NO confirmed hackers, then everyone in the clan gets double GP from missions. I think this would make it impossible for anyone to hack while in a clan, thus reducing VIP hacks, as well as high level hackers."
This won't make it impossible to hack, nothing is stopping them.
and once a hacker is confirmed there account is banned anyways (they just make a new account )
so all this does is increase the amount of GP rewarded for missions for clans that have never had a hacker in them.
2. "while we are talking about changing the way rooms work, rooms could be ranked by the average KDR of the people inside it. then at least Nubs wouldn't join a room where the average was 2.5, if you wanted to take it further you could make the KDR average specific to that game mode. eg, if its a ghost mode room, then the average ghost mode score is displayed."
Nubs are nubs because they refuse to learn how to play the game or anything about the game, they'll most likely ignore any form of KDR display and join anyways.
3. "as far as ping limited rooms go. by making only a few ranges, more players are likely to join. although it is not the best for getting a perfect room every time, i would choose <100 and <200 as the only ping restrictions, if there were any more values, it think it would create the separation of the community into those with high pings, and those without. lets face it, 100 ping is not very much lag, and if you do like 99, then a little QQ might be OK, but otherwise, the guy had you killed anyway. less than 200 is generally playable with a few minor irritations, and more than 200 starts to get really annoying."
Reasonable, and I've played with stable 120 ping before, other then having to aim about 5 feet ahead of my target it wasn't that hard.
lol, good point. the sorting rooms by kdr idea would also likely be abused
Clan "hey guys, i found a room that averages .25, you guys down to pubfarm"
Me - Clan "hell yeah"
Clan "yes"
Clan "ill get my m12 and tomy lol"
Clan "time to practice using kukri XD"
the gp idea is kinda stupid too since hackers will hopefully get banned. perhaps something more along the lines of if you have a hacker in your clan at any time during the month your reward is revoked for 30 days. and maybe change the reward to something like...
the ability to chose which zp crates you get, instead of just having de scope all the time. i already have deagle cammo, deagle, ana advance, and 6 m9s, why do i need the de scope."Ping limited servers are not the best solution" Don't know for sure myself.
"Ping limited ROOMS might be a better option" Won't solve the hacking issue, but a useful feature.
"Ping is something that might be harder to hack than normal game files" I know for fact the only way to get around it is to hack the server itself. And who would hack a server just to play with a hack?
"The only way to ABSOLUTELY catch hackers is to have server side processing devoted to the task" The problem isn't catching them, it's there sheer numbers and inability to stop them from starting again from scratch.
Edit: just noticed I doubled posted, I'm tired XD
agree, +1
although the ping limited rooms are a better way to keep lagers out than ping limited server IMO
and i should rephrase, server side anti hack measures are the only AUTOMATED method that will deal with hackers without any risk of them bypassing it, the challenge is the tremendous amount of computer power needed to do that. -
lol, good point. the sorting rooms by kdr idea would also likely be abused
Clan "hey guys, i found a room that averages .25, you guys down to pubfarm"
Me - Clan "hell yeah"
Clan "yes"
Clan "ill get my m12 and tomy lol"
Clan "time to practice using kukri XD"
the gp idea is kinda stupid too since hackers will hopefully get banned. perhaps something more along the lines of if you have a hacker in your clan at any time during the month your reward is revoked for 30 days. and maybe change the reward to something like...
the ability to chose which zp crates you get, instead of just having de scope all the time. i already have deagle cammo, deagle, ana advance, and 6 m9s, why do i need the de scope.
agree, +1
although the ping limited rooms are a better way to keep lagers out than ping limited server IMO
and i should rephrase, server side anti hack measures are the only AUTOMATED method that will deal with hackers without any risk of them bypassing it, the challenge is the tremendous amount of computer power needed to do that.
atleast have the clan name written down right gawd you noob -
Off topic: So this is your forum name, I often wondered.
On topic: Before we can make a solution to the hacking problem we must first understand why people hack in the first place. The three most common reasons I can think of for a person to hack are.
1. Wants to win no matter what.
2. Thinks or sees alot of other people doing it and does it to even the odds.
3. Just wants to have fun and make people Angry.
Next which group has the highest percent of hackers? In the NA servers its SA players.
So why do so many SA players resort to hacking? The root cause is a mix of there PING and lack of sportsmanship.
A player with 150+ is at a massive disadvantage, They receive game info later then other players and it takes longer to send info. Add to the fact that most of them are children who can't stand losing its no wonder most of them resort to hacking.
Children usually want to win games and high ping makes that hard.
Children don't usually understand how a online games works so can't understand why the players they shoot won't die.
Children are more likely to enjoy making people angry.
So they want to win but are unable too, so they resort to hacking.
They don't understand why other players don't die when it looks like too them they took a whole clip of bullets so they think the other players are hacking, thus use hacks to even the odds.
And any troll will tell you how fun it is too see other players react to any form of trolling.
So with that out of the way, whats the best way to reduce the hacking?
My suggestion would be to make Ping limited servers.
Just reposting this for those who skip a lot of the pages.
Short summary. High ping is the biggest factor for hacking in this game, and this thread is about ways to reduce the hacking.lol, good point. the sorting rooms by kdr idea would also likely be abused
Clan "hey guys, i found a room that averages .25, you guys down to pubfarm"
Me - Clan "hell yeah"
Clan "yes"
Clan "ill get my m12 and tomy lol"
Clan "time to practice using kukri XD"
the gp idea is kinda stupid too since hackers will hopefully get banned. perhaps something more along the lines of if you have a hacker in your clan at any time during the month your reward is revoked for 30 days. and maybe change the reward to something like...
the ability to chose which zp crates you get, instead of just having de scope all the time. i already have deagle cammo, deagle, ana advance, and 6 m9s, why do i need the de scope.
agree, +1
although the ping limited rooms are a better way to keep lagers out than ping limited server IMO
and i should rephrase, server side anti hack measures are the only AUTOMATED method that will deal with hackers without any risk of them bypassing it, the challenge is the tremendous amount of computer power needed to do that.
That is not the only problem with making a server sided anti hack. First the game needs to be made server sided. It is currently client sided, and the amount of reprogramming it would take to make it server sided would be harder then just starting from scratch.
A ping based solution wouldn't be that taxing tho, a ping test usually only uses a few KB and a program to disconnect anyone with a high ping or fails a certain number of ping test won't take much memory or ram to run. Versus a complex program designed to scan for modified files and third party software.
weather if its room based or whole server based, a ping based solution will greatly reduce hacking.
Server ping cap cons: if its only a couple servers, rarely used, if its most servers 300,000 players are either removed or relocated to different servers.
Room based cap cons: doesn't directly deal with the hacking issue, hackers will stay but we will have a way to avoid them. -
LmaoItsKol wrote: »atleast have the clan name written down right gawd you noob
off topic: to be honest I find having a ™ at the end of a clan name only makes me think they're less professional, mostly because every other clan uses it and most of them don't last a week. -
heres my idea
crossfire needs to scan the folder before opening the game if any files are changed or added then it simply wont open i personally wouldnt mind waiting a few mins for it to scan the folder to play the game ligitly that would completly take away the ha/ckers theres no possible way to my knowledge that u can create a ghost program and put it in a folder with it working -
off topic: to be honest I find having a ™ at the end of a clan name only makes me think they're less professional, mostly because every other clan uses it and most of them don't last a week.
lols my clan has been around alot longer than a week. and i know it was off topic but i was messing wit him ingame and he told me to take a look at what you both were talking about ooo my clans only a few day older than your clan -
55supermario wrote: »heres my idea
crossfire needs to scan the folder before opening the game if any files are changed or added then it simply wont open i personally wouldnt mind waiting a few mins for it to scan the folder to play the game ligitly that would completly take away the ha/ckers theres no possible way to my knowledge that u can create a ghost program and put it in a folder with it working
Its already doing that, the problem is the hacks are bypassing the scanner. -
LmaoItsKol wrote: »lols my clan has been around alot longer than a week. and i know it was off topic but i was messing wit him ingame and he told me to take a look at what you both were talking about ooo my clans only a few day older than your clan
I know your clans been around for awhile and has many good players.
Just saying the ™ just reminds me of all the clans in scrims I faced that fail hard at this game. -
Off topic: So this is your forum name, I often wondered.
On topic: Before we can make a solution to the hacking problem we must first understand why people hack in the first place. The three most common reasons I can think of for a person to hack are.
1. Wants to win no matter what.
2. Thinks or sees alot of other people doing it and does it to even the odds.
3. Just wants to have fun and make people Angry.
Next which group has the highest percent of hackers? In the NA servers its SA players.
So why do so many SA players resort to hacking? The root cause is a mix of there PING and lack of sportsmanship.
A player with 150+ is at a massive disadvantage, They receive game info later then other players and it takes longer to send info. Add to the fact that most of them are children who can't stand losing its no wonder most of them resort to hacking.
Children usually want to win games and high ping makes that hard.
Children don't usually understand how a online games works so can't understand why the players they shoot won't die.
Children are more likely to enjoy making people angry.
So they want to win but are unable too, so they resort to hacking.
They don't understand why other players don't die when it looks like too them they took a whole clip of bullets so they think the other players are hacking, thus use hacks to even the odds.
And any troll will tell you how fun it is too see other players react to any form of trolling.
So with that out of the way, whats the best way to reduce the hacking?
My suggestion would be to make Ping limited servers.
i Agree 1000% With you i think the same way but i prefer a Vip systeem -
stop being racist, Z8 should try to create a server in brazil, the ''BR'' lag would stop bother American people, or even people from Europe (BR's go to UK server too)
Try to make a brazilian server would not be a bad idea
1: Z8 doesn't have a license to make a Brazilian server, and intill G4BOX grants one, it won't happen.
2: its not racist stating facts. The majority of hackers have 150+ ping, this does not mean all or most 150+ hack. it just means there are more hackers with 150+ then with less then 150 ping.
3: why would you go to a server that is 4,000+ kilometers away when there is one that is 700 kilometers from you?
4: you just added more evidence that BRs don't research anything before they post.
5: And finally this is a thread about REDUCING hackers, what does a Brazil server do to reduce them? -
My ideas:
1. ScreenShot the person in middle of the game. (When I was nub i thinked thatr HGW did that :b)
2. Movement speed sensor? Its like the dudes who run faster than a knife get error.
3. To play you need to activate the account! Cuz all hackers put a random email and then go play. Why? Because they need to create 2 accounts and they dont want to lose time.xP -
Katty_Perry wrote: »Ping cap restriction as most hackers are BR's or Egy's.
Getting the anti-hack that them china guys are using.
Mac address ban.
And: If running faster than normal speed (excluding HM/MM) you get autokicked, if you shoot faster than normal you get auto kicked, if you jump higher than usual (excluding double/triple jump) you get auto kicked and if you shoot a sniper fast you get auto kicked.
Btw, tl;dr
Nope because there are also turk,italian,NA,UK,FR cheaters.
I don't know what kind of anti-cheat CF CN uses but their company is like google. Tremendously big and rich.
Mac address can be masked and changed with surprising ease.
The last one... well it sould completely change the coding of the game so not going to happen.
lol@at the guy suggestin PB.
It fails just like VAC
Seriously there is no way to eliminate cheaters.
As long as we have coding and programming there will be ways to bypass the code. -
I've said this before many a time.
start banning windows keys and use PunkBuster.
yes, no anti-hack is perfect. but lets face it, Xtrap is fail. PunkBuster is a step up from xtrap in my mind.
but, by banning Windows Keys its a LOT harder to get around, lets face it not many people are going to spend $100ish on a new copy of windows. there would also have to be a windows key registered with the account so if someone got banned and tryed to "Use" your key they would be unable to do so.
my suggestion is this in a nut shell, perma and windows key ban(s) you may get around the account ban but your OS key is still banned =D
btw, yes I know a LOT of people arent using legit copys.... im not a rere... XD
if we can't IP ban Brazil, then just put a server in Mexico as it could be part of North America due to NAFTA including Mexico, just a thought =P -
Are you stupid or something?LoKGundam288 wrote: »I've said this before many a time.
start banning windows keys and use PunkBuster.
yes, no anti-hack is perfect. but lets face it, Xtrap is fail. PunkBuster is a step up from xtrap in my mind.
but, by banning Windows Keys its a LOT harder to get around, lets face it not many people are going to spend $100ish on a new copy of windows. there would also have to be a windows key registered with the account so if someone got banned and tryed to "Use" your key they would be unable to do so.
my suggestion is this in a nut shell, perma and windows key ban(s) you may get around the account ban but your OS key is still banned =D
btw, yes I know a LOT of people arent using legit copys.... im not a rere... XD
if we can't IP ban Brazil, then just put a server in Mexico as it could be part of North America due to NAFTA including Mexico, just a thought =P
Crossfire doesn't take as data the windows key.
It just takes whatever it needs to work (ip for example)
Microsoft would never accept that anyway.
Punkbuster fails.
There is no impenetratable anti-cheat. -
My internet for some odd reason it's ping never seems to be stable.
In the morning I get 40-50 ping, in the afternoon I get like 60-70 ping, after dinner from like 8 pm to 11 pm I get about 120-140 ping and about 11:30 pm it starts decreasing again to 40-50 ping.
I usually dont play after dinner lol, just wait a few hours.
In ping restricted servers if I joined at a certain time and my ping then caped the maximum ping available to join such servers would I be able to be there still or would it auto kick me?
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