Public PSA and potentially goodbye
Comments
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To any GM reading.. Please don't look in to this thread as a threat, we just want justice for this unfairness. I myself don't hate any of you all, we are all humans we all make mistakes. But this is clearly a decision made from emotions and not from fair point of view. Please make the right move here.. Don't get rid of us like this. I beg you
all the good times, all the events, ranked matches, zombie modes.. and more we don't want them to go.. -
All I see is a player saying he was banned unfairly and his friends supporting him, while there is no clue if he did used scripts or not.
Like copycat said it's your word against the GM.
Personally I wouldn't be surprised if you were using macros, I have seen countless players with good old accounts using them, especially in ranked and GMs just let them play. TOP100 is literally a joke, everyone uses macros without getting punished. Who knows, maybe you saw that and thought "Well, they dont even ban them in ranked, lets troll in public".
Also, pretty sure you don't just get perm banned for using scripts at once, probably you were caught more times. -
I'm quite confused honestly, I don't know what methods do the GMs use to determine if someone is hacking or using a third party program since they don't disclose it nor they inform the reporters of their conclusions due to their ToS and Privacy Policy but someone being banned for playing with a GM and killing him is just terrifying. Also the concept of just being locked out of communication after being banned just adds up to the problem.
I get that it's probably in place because of players who are justifiably banned and did break the ToS keep sending tickets no matter what but we should agree that mistakes happen to everyone, and this isn't defending those who broke the ToS but adding the possibility that a GM might have let his emotions get the best of him as some of the players above mentioned. It just doesn't make any sense that a legit player would get banned for mastering a weapon, an OP weapon I should add since I've seen some players annihilate full teams with them.
I'm not sure if the GMs actually retain the proof of each ban (which should be the case, and should even be disclosed to the banned player, not just a written reason) and I really hope that a GM would take his time and look into this case as I'm just baffled something like this would happen. I've seen similar cases of potentially unjust bans here on the forum but I don't think I've seen a case where a GM banned players for being better than him in a public game.I know adding a ban appeal department is kind of a stretch and would just bombard you guys with tickets as mistakes like this rarely happen, but bottom line is, the possibility is there so please look into this, this is just sad. -
dunno123444 wrote: »All I see is a player saying he was banned unfairly and his friends supporting him, while there is no clue if he did used scripts or not.
Like copycat said it's your word against the GM.
Personally I wouldn't be surprised if you were using macros, I have seen countless players with good old accounts using them, especially in ranked and GMs just let them play. TOP100 is literally a joke, everyone uses macros without getting punished. Who knows, maybe you saw that and thought "Well, they dont even ban them in ranked, lets troll in public".
Also, pretty sure you don't just get perm banned for using scripts at once, probably you were caught more times.
I can understand your argument, but please try to approach this from a hypothetical situation. What do you do if you get banned for something you didn't do? This could have happened to you, or any other number of players, and I'm 100% sure that there are other players who have been unjustly banned. They are assuming that I am guilty until proven innocent, but how do I even prove my innocence when I am being censored and blatantly ignored? Those assumptions are extremely counterproductive to this discussion. I have my honourable soldier ribbon, I've never been banned. This is a clear cut case of an abuse of power. -
the gm's can do whatever they want. They can ban your account whenever they suspect anything. They don't need any proof whatsoever (it's in the company rules when you start playing the game).
I really hope some gm wants to give this a second opinion. From my experience, those chances are rather slim.
When I play public SnD and I see someone with Gatling I'm assuming they are scripting. I've played against too many scripters in ranked and it bothered and frustrated me a lot. I see no reason for using the Gatling gun. -
loller1207 wrote: »When I play public SnD and I see someone with Gatling I'm assuming they are scripting. I've played against too many scripters in ranked and it bothered and frustrated me a lot. I see no reason for using the Gatling gun.
If players aren't allowed to use a gun that they bought with their own money from the VIP section in the Item Shop, then why bother implementing it into the game and making it available for sale in the first place?
The only scripters I've encountered in ranked were players that had rapid fire macros on their pistols (USP, Cop and Raging Bull). I've submitted in-game reports on them, but I still see a lot of them still playing from time to time. -
Again, even if we remove myself from this situation and we strictly talk about the hypothetical, what can a person in this sort of situation do? Say someone gets falsely accused, which I'm sure has happened before. Does this mean that you should be recording every single game with a GM in case of an accusation? Should you be recording the entire chat log for everything they say?
Nothing. Theres nothing you can do at all.
But from my experience even the obvious macro users in ranked matches seem to take ages to get banned, if they ever do get banned at all.
Also In my 11 or whatever years of playing this game, I have NEVER randomly seen a gm in a pub match, so idk if youre talking about crossfire WEST or BR.
On top of that to have those 2 things coincide is just astronomically improbable. -
Nothing. Theres nothing you can do at all.
But from my experience even the obvious macro users in ranked matches seem to take ages to get banned, if they ever do get banned at all.
Also In my 11 or whatever years of playing this game, I have NEVER randomly seen a gm in a pub match, so idk if youre talking about crossfire WEST or BR.
On top of that to have those 2 things coincide is just astronomically improbable.
Well this is the forums for Crossfire West. I don't think anyone ever brought up Crossfire BR in this thread. -
Nothing. Theres nothing you can do at all.
But from my experience even the obvious macro users in ranked matches seem to take ages to get banned, if they ever do get banned at all.
Also In my 11 or whatever years of playing this game, I have NEVER randomly seen a gm in a pub match, so idk if youre talking about crossfire WEST or BR.
On top of that to have those 2 things coincide is just astronomically improbable.
I am strictly talking about Crossfire West, as this is the forum for this version. I have never implied that this is happening on any other version of Crossfire. I am stating that I have seen this GM in various different pubs. Multiple people can back me up, including people who have posted in this very thread. This is not some sort of astronomical improbability like you are mentioning, as I have been made aware of many other people in similar situations such as mine. Like you said yourself, I literally cannot do anything else on my end. All I can do is make people aware of what has happened to me and try to prevent something like this from happening to other people going forward. -
It's ridiculous. Why would a person who is playing for 11 years use hack? on top of that, he bought VIPs and invested in your company. Common sense doesn't prevail at Z8games, it seems. Take this matter up with GMs on discord and I really really hope you get your account back.
They have made soo many players leave this game with this ridiculous approach. Abel left CF due to this attitude, PTuga, Kiita and Danah, to name a few, were also sidelined by stupid rigid rules. Funnily enough they would never ban obvious renowned hackers who are responsible for ruining Ranked mode. -
As always, there are two sides to every story. Additionally, if someone is banned and sends an appeal ticket (which I know first hand you have done) it gets reviewed in full by another GM seperate from the one who banned you. As such you can say what you wish, but this matter has already been handled and you have already been given a final answer.
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[QUOTE=[GM]Kanadian;n6945029]As always, there are two sides to every story. Additionally, if someone is banned and sends an appeal ticket (which I know first hand you have done) it gets reviewed in full by another GM seperate from the one who banned you. As such you can say what you wish, but this matter has already been handled and you have already been given a final answer.[/QUOTE]
I don't know the history of their accounts, but how can a first offense end up in a perma ban? like cmon man on, both of them. I wasn't included because I don't own the damn vip, I wish I had it at that moment.
Have you seen how bad he is at the game? Livestreams don't lie. MULTIPLE PPL have bad encounters with this GM myself included. Why couldn't it be a 7 days or 14 days Ban. Could care less if you banned me of the forums. I'm done with this game. -
Well, I suppose this is the end for me. I still cannot believe what happened here. I don't even know what to say. If my unjust ban was able to be approved by multiple GMs, then I must truly be the unluckiest guy in the entire game. A permanent ban for 1 false accusation of macroing on an otherwise reputable account, I am just speechless. Thanks again for those who were willing to listen to me, and I cannot give enough thanks to the people who stood up for me. I am greatly saddened by this whole situation, and to be honest I never really expected to get unbanned in the first place due to the many other people in similar situations not getting any justice either. Going forward I would love to see Crossfire grow, but seeing what has been happening to this game I love over the past few months and years has been hard to watch. This is the final nail in the coffin, entirely due to circumstances out of my own hands. I guess I'll make a separate forum post later just to say goodbye officially. Please understand what happened here. Do not make the same mistake that I did. I still stand by everything I said, and I would like people to remember what happened here even after I am gone.
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MeisterAlW wrote: »
If players aren't allowed to use a gun that they bought with their own money from the VIP section in the Item Shop, then why bother implementing it into the game and making it available for sale in the first place?
The only scripters I've encountered in ranked were players that had rapid fire macros on their pistols (USP, Cop and Raging Bull). I've submitted in-game reports on them, but I still see a lot of them still playing from time to time.
I don't say that the players aren't allowed to use it. All I am saying is that it is stupid and annoying and super noob (this is my opinion).
I have seen a lot of Gatling gun macros. The recoil on that weapon is lower if you macro it. It doesn't shoot faster. -
loller1207 wrote: »
I don't say that the players aren't allowed to use it. All I am saying is that it is stupid and annoying and super noob (this is my opinion).
I have seen a lot of Gatling gun macros. The recoil on that weapon is lower if you macro it. It doesn't shoot faster.
This simply further proves my point, I've never even seen anyone do what I'm being accused of. He stated that I was shooting without startup time which is blatantly false, as any number of users have already pointed out that you can keep the barrel spinning by tapping mouse 1. Anyone who has actually used the VIP Gatling knows this. If I was using a no recoil macro, then this whole discussion would be useless. You can easily tell if someone is using that based on a replay, but what I am being accused of is completely different and false. -
This simply further proves my point, I've never even seen anyone do what I'm being accused of. He stated that I was shooting without startup time which is blatantly false, as any number of users have already pointed out that you can keep the barrel spinning by tapping mouse 1. Anyone who has actually used the VIP Gatling knows this. If I was using a no recoil macro, then this whole discussion would be useless. You can easily tell if someone is using that based on a replay, but what I am being accused of is completely different and false.
If you truly didn't use anything, the gm should reflect. But in my experience, they never come back on a decision. -
2kiki2 is the most legit player ever. the ban is absurd and should be removed ASAP with an apology and some kind of compensation to the player. unbelievable
What I find unbelievable is that a GM doesn't know you can continuously tap left mouse button to keep the GG barrel spinning. Even thinking that someone would use a macro with VVIP GG is ridiculous as it basically has no recoil. I have seen so many people using it in TD and S&D and there is no need to use macros with it since it's way too good as is. The GMs should use it themselves to see how good it really is and then unban him but that's not going to happen because they are always right and never make mistakes. -
MeisterAlW wrote: »
If players aren't allowed to use a gun that they bought with their own money from the VIP section in the Item Shop, then why bother implementing it into the game and making it available for sale in the first place?
The only scripters I've encountered in ranked were players that had rapid fire macros on their pistols (USP, Cop and Raging Bull). I've submitted in-game reports on them, but I still see a lot of them still playing from time to time.
You don't really need any macro to speed up shooting when it comes to the USP and COP. 99% of the times people complain about people using macros with them, they are just crappy clickers themselves and can't understand that others can click faster than they do. I can shoot my COP empty (6 shots) in just over a second and it has zero or little recoil while doing it. I can shoot the USP just a little slower, with pretty good accuracy and I am a mediocre player. It just takes a little practice to get the speed up.
The SOCOM and the Anniversary (or CFS) Colt are also guns that you can shoot very fast with and still have good accuracy.
If they are up to that speed with the RB I would definitely scream cheater though.
It's supposed to say what you do with your computer mouse, got censored by the great anti foul-language system. I wonder when they are going to fix that.JackPain (Sweden) -
What I find unbelievable is that a GM doesn't know you can continuously tap left mouse button to keep the GG barrel spinning. Even thinking that someone would use a macro with VVIP GG is ridiculous as it basically has no recoil. I have seen so many people using it in TD and S&D and there is no need to use macros with it since it's way too good as is. The GMs should use it themselves to see how good it really is and then unban him but that's not going to happen because they are always right and never make mistakes.
This is exactly why it's so absurd. This GM has the VIP Gatling Gun on the account he banned us from. He literally stated it takes "2 seconds" to start up. Clearly he either does not know how to use the gun, or maybe just has not used it frequently enough to understand the mechanics. My 2 other clanmates who were in the match can back me up on EVERYTHING I have been saying over these past couple of days. Again, I am not the only one who is affected here. If this had happened without the small amount of support and evidence I have provided, I cannot imagine what a lesser known player would have to go through to resolve a situation such as this. There is no way to know how many other people have been in a similar situation as mine and speaking from the numerous people who have contacted me, I can assure you that I am not alone. I cannot describe how much I regret not saving every single thing he said and then saving the replay. There is nothing more I can provide, and there seemingly has been no addressing of the inherent issue at hand. What can a player do if they are falsely banned? Why was I effectively cut off of any sort of help through the official channels? I was assumed guilty until proved innocent, but without any real way to provide further evidence of my innocence. I am at a dead end here, and I have already come to terms with the fact that my account is likely gone forever. The entire point of this thread is simply just to let people know what happened and function as a reminder to be diligent in the future so that you may not be as unfortunate as me. The amount of support from people in the Discord has been truly heartwarming, and I suppose I'll be making an official goodbye post sometime later this week as a way to reminisce about all of the good and bad experiences that I've had throughout my 11 years of playing this game.
As a side note, I will likely try to reply to any posts on this thread for the next week or so until I make my official goodbye post, and I'm trying my best to keep on top of things. Thank you guys so much for the support, and I hope we can help save some other peoples' accounts going forward. -
Nothing. Theres nothing you can do at all.
But from my experience even the obvious macro users in ranked matches seem to take ages to get banned, if they ever do get banned at all.
Also In my 11 or whatever years of playing this game, I have NEVER randomly seen a gm in a pub match, so idk if youre talking about crossfire WEST or BR.
On top of that to have those 2 things coincide is just astronomically improbable.
LOL then there are people like you, who thinks ppl are macroing , first, gm are in a pub match, mainly in west.
Second, when are you gonna ban me? I been waiting for 2 weeks. -
But man, I think there are a good chance you are telling the truth here, I been playing for 11 years too, been in Lans and in the same city where the company is.
I can tell you for a fact that the company has change quite a bit, check out the reviews and info on glassdoor for smilegate west. Unless you are real close to a gm,
unfortunately they won't spend the effort to do a deep investigation on this case, things are way more automatic in terms of how t hey are running the company now days,
They use to do small gesture and really answer to players in game, when there was only the support ticket, vent muble etc. Now days, there are less players, more
ways/tools to communicate with players, such as Discord, yet probably less people working in the company, especially people who actually cares for the game and consumers.
Met Lasagnya, Kanadian, Cinder in Lan, they are generally nice people, but the structure and management probably don't give them enough time and
room to actually improve on these issues, is just a job after all. After all.. they are in charge of different things too, but dam, one of my friend did have a similar experience and it is devastating
as an old player myself, the reason why this is getting so much attention is that as old players, we can relate.
can you whisper me that gm's alt's ign btw? -
But man, I think there are a good chance you are telling the truth here, I been playing for 11 years too, been in Lans and in the same city where the company is.
I can tell you for a fact that the company has change quite a bit, check out the reviews and info on glassdoor for smilegate west. Unless you are real close to a gm,
unfortunately they won't spend the effort to do a deep investigation on this case, things are way more automatic in terms of how t hey are running the company now days,
They use to do small gesture and really answer to players in game, when there was only the support ticket, vent muble etc. Now days, there are less players, more
ways/tools to communicate with players, such as Discord, yet probably less people working in the company, especially people who actually cares for the game and consumers.
Met Lasagnya, Kanadian, Cinder in Lan, they are generally nice people, but the structure and management probably don't give them enough time and
room to actually improve on these issues, is just a job after all. After all.. they are in charge of different things too, but dam, one of my friend did have a similar experience and it is devastating
as an old player myself, the reason why this is getting so much attention is that as old players, we can relate.
Thank you for your input. It means so much to me to see the community stand behind what I am saying, and I truly appreciate each and every comment on this thread. I seriously wish I had the chance to say hello to the GMs in person, and make some friends with fellow members of the Crossfire community. Maybe I will eventually get to meet them one day even if I don't end up unbanned. I saw that they were at EGLX a few years back and I really wanted to go say hello and participate in some of the events held at that time. I ended up volunteering at the next EGLX in hopes of being able to participate in something like that again, but unfortunately it seems like that was a one time deal. When I was volunteering, I heard the Crossfire theme playing throughout the avenue a few times and it really felt special to me that this game I love was able to still host events at places like EGLX. Even though I didn't get to take part in that specific event, I'm still looking forward to whatever comes next. That ribbon for attending an offline CF event would have been the cherry on top and I would have been able to hit 75 ribbons by now. I am sure that they are great people, and I have no animosity towards them. This is just a very rough situation for everyone. -
A time ago, i said to myself i wasnt going to keep playing this game until they fix the crap garbage software they call a game that keeps benefitting those who actually are the issue, i allways got so mad over this game issue, but GMs never were an issue, after seeing your port, i realize that this game is finished, its like the worst people at their jobs endend up in this game company and somehow it still even runs.. after so much love, multiple great comunitys, so much money thrown in content thats not even real, thats exactly how they love to present us. Anyways i kept watching forums and from time to time login just to join a match to see if there was anything improved, so far nothing made me change my mind to comeback playing this crap, and after reading this story i can surely tell that im completely done with this. Because i too have arouns 9/10 years of playing this game, i too enjoy sometimes playing gatling gun on a SnD which obviously requires to allways pre-heat to succed, so you can instant fire and kill an enemy, GMs dont even know what game they're managing, its just sad, shows how much they dont give a crap about us and the game, i will be waiting for the next version of this game hopefully with brand new managers and developers that actually put some effort in the western version... im done being treated like sht, servers dont even work for months, if you can tell me one thing in this game that has been working all these years that are not related to any form of profit i comeback, but because not only i know theres nothing, but also because im never coming back to the forums, i wont. Wish you guys all the best, stay safe and ffs stop throwing money and sustaining these incompetents.. cya.
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Thats weird. Even I who have no account issues would love nothing more than to see this game die and z8 go bankrupt. I'd easily forget all of the money I wasted in this game/company if it was to sink.Going forward I would love to see Crossfire grow, but seeing what has been happening to this game I love over the past few months and years has been hard to watch. This is the final nail in the coffin, entirely due to circumstances out of my own hands.loller1207 wrote: »
I don't say that the players aren't allowed to use it. All I am saying is that it is stupid and annoying and super noob (this is my opinion).
I have seen a lot of Gatling gun macros. The recoil on that weapon is lower if you macro it. It doesn't shoot faster.
Exactly lmao, afaik there are no scripts to aid with gg starting up faster. Cant vouch for how true is that he accused you of scripting rather than cheating, but only way to make the gun shoot faster is by using a cheat.
I still remember when they use to actually review hacking reports daily instead of this bucket fill system where they only review a player's report if he gets enough ingame reports, and on top of that you also use to get a reply to it and seeing the ticket get closed.They use to do small gesture and really answer to players in game, when there was only the support ticket, vent muble etc. Now days, there are less players, more
ways/tools to communicate with players, such as Discord, yet probably less people working in the company, especially people who actually cares for the game and consumers..
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/EWDo7tQ.png"}[/IMG2]
Now its just 50 pages of unreviewed replays, so I dont bother submitting any hacking reports anymore.
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/W45chUi.png"}[/IMG2] -
Looks like the GM in question has changed both his account name and clan name, and I don't know why. I have recorded video evidence that this has happened, and the clan description is still the exact same so I know for a fact that it is the same one as yesterday. The clan literally only has 1 member in it. The timing of this is extremely strange, and I would like to call attention to what is happening right now in case something happens. I am not trying to imply anything here, only protect myself going forward.
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[QUOTE=[GM]Kanadian;n6945029]As always, there are two sides to every story. Additionally, if someone is banned and sends an appeal ticket (which I know first hand you have done) it gets reviewed in full by another GM seperate from the one who banned you. As such you can say what you wish, but this matter has already been handled and you have already been given a final answer.[/QUOTE]
It's wrong on soo many levels. First, he is an 11-year-old veteran and been with the game for 11 years and his CF history seems to be clean. On top of that, he spent money on this game. Now tell me why would he try to use macro? why would he risk his 11-year-old account with tons of VIPs for some kills? One of my friends also lost his account a year ago due to such accusation of using macro and I can see another loyal player going down over such a baseless accusation.
Please Canadian, you know that there are many obvious macro users in rooftop rooms in every channel but they never get banned. I don't know okikio and probably never played with him, but his profile doesn't sound like someone who used hack or macro. It's pretty obvious. I think it's time to change old rigid, inflexible century-old rules of not going back on your bans. It's not a player you are losing but a loyal veteran customer who stayed with the game for years despite the ups and downs of the game. kindly look into this matter again and show people that z8 actually cares for its players. -
It's wrong on soo many levels. First, he is an 11-year-old veteran and been with the game for 11 years and his CF history seems to be clean. On top of that, he spent money on this game. Now tell me why would he try to use macro? why would he risk his 11-year-old account with tons of VIPs for some kills? One of my friends also lost his account a year ago due to such accusation of using macro and I can see another loyal player going down over such a baseless accusation.
Please Canadian, you know that there are many obvious macro users in rooftop rooms in every channel but they never get banned. I don't know okikio and probably never played with him, but his profile doesn't sound like someone who used hack or macro. It's pretty obvious. I think it's time to change old rigid, inflexible century-old rules of not going back on your bans. It's not a player you are losing but a loyal veteran customer who stayed with the game for years despite the ups and downs of the game. kindly look into this matter again and show people that z8 actually cares for its players.
Thank you so much for your continued support. The more people we have rallied behind this, the better chance we have of maybe preventing something like this from happening again in the future. Even if I don't get unbanned and they still don't believe me despite everything me and many others have been discussing, please try to do something about this for players in the future. I have yet to hear any sort of reasonable solution to the scenario that I am currently in, and if it is not addressed in any capacity then I have nothing else to say. I would love to have a ban appeal department like Medusa had mentioned earlier, however I also do understand that it takes a lot of resources and it may not be possible to do so due to a variety of reasons. I have literally been losing sleep trying to document everything that is happening and trying to respond to as many people as I can. I can only hope that the meeting that was held today was about this whole scenario, and that we can expect some more communication on their end.
Time and time again, I just don't understand how I have absolutely no credibility for what I am saying here. If we assume that I am telling the truth even for a single second, how can the fact that this ban was approved by two separate GMs be ignored? Again, if we can assume I am telling the truth for another second, what do I do from here? Try to put yourself in my shoes for just a moment and realize that I have exhausted quite literally every single option I have to try and get some sort of support. I have tried to be as civil as possible throughout this entire ordeal but it feels to me as though nothing I have said will matter in the end. The final answer appears to have been decided from the very beginning, and it seems like the underlying flaws within the system that allowed something like this to happen have gone unchecked for much too long. Many other people have reported false bans, so surely at least some of them must be telling the truth, right? Too many of our community's most loyal players have already departed from this game due to a breakdown of communication and lack of transparency due to what I can only assume to be "rigid rules" as olpers so aptly put it. Something must be done about this, not only for my sake but for so many other players as well.
I have tried to be 100% honest and transparent in this situation and if there are any questions, I am more than willing to answer them. If you prefer to talk via Discord, feel free to add me, 0kiki0#8158. If me posting my discord publicly is not allowed, I do apologize, and please simply remove my Discord information.
I am literally going to do a ZP giveaway on the discord, provided that it is allowed, as a final goodbye if nothing productive comes out of this whole discussion. I have 20k ZP left that I was going to load up for this month, but I can't even do anything with it anymore. -
The final answer appears to have been decided from the very beginning, and it seems like the underlying flaws within the system that allowed something like this to happen have gone unchecked for much too long.
I totally agree. Probably anyone who once had to deal with support have this feeling.
It seems like the only thing is to hope one will never need them for something important, nothing else to do...
![[GM]Kanadian](https://z8games.akamaized.net/cfna/forum/customavatars/61/navatar_22385461.gif){kind=avatar}
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