The Guide of Flawed Logic
Comments
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you know how in worldwide gaming and lan's how much of a difference a smaller head would be?
a head with 10inches diametrer and a head with 9inchers diametrer is a HUGE difference in the world of gaming
Except the head is only (guessing) around an inch or less when you're standing 10 feet away. The difference there (if there is one in the hitboxes) is about a 1/3 of a centimeter. Cause that third is SO much.. Plus the head of a spop shows through smoke so I see no reason to cry about it.
Just wondering but if you're such a "competitive" player, why does it bother you so much about spops and m12s? I know you don't want people pointing out about "being good enough" but if you're going to be playing competitively, you should have a reaction time fast enough to pz someone with a spop/m12s without a problem. -
if they use league allowed items and you killed them fine a)
if they use league allowed items and you died , fine b)
if you die while they used non league allowed items it's their fault not your's c)
If you shoot someone in certain position in case a) the same way u shot the person in case c) who's that ur fault you died? in the world of competitive gaming a head with 9 inches when all the other head is 10 inches makes a HUGE , HUGE , HUGE difference , a player with the skill level of that team can easily take down a whole team , the players shoot in a spot they could kill an official char , let's say ur skill lvl is 100 points , and opponent's skill lvl is 95 points.
you are good enough to kill him , but if he's a zp wh0re , m12's , sl's , spop's his skill lvl is now 110 and you aren't able to kill him, but you ARE good enough to kill him , 'cept he's using all of that , please understand my point and don't start pointing out "be good enough"
Because in fact, once your skill level gets that high. Spray pattern and ROF are irrelavant. You only need 1 bullet to kill and all guns shoot the first bullet at the same time. M12s would actually hold you back because it's not always a 1 shot kill.
SPOP should not worry you much because you hit the centre of the head anyway. HOWEVER, I will admit that it does give a competitive advantage when peaking etc (Like I said in the SPOP section). BUT, noone in this version of crossfire/nor any others, I believe have ever been able to use this to its full potential.
Basically what i'm trying to say is, there has never been someone so good/amazing that when they put on SPOP noone else can kill them because their peak time is 0.0001s faster. -
you know how in worldwide gaming and lan's how much of a difference a smaller head would be?
a head with 10inches diametrer and a head with 9inchers diametrer is a HUGE difference in the world of gaming
Wrong
A Head Of 10 Inches And A Head Of 9.9 Inches Is A Huge Difference And Could Cause Serious Problems
A 1 inch Difference Could Spell Disaster -
Even if they were using M12s, ofc it's your fault you died. You weren't good enough. If you instead believed it was your fault, you would eventually get better.Because in fact, once your skill level gets that high. Spray pattern and ROF are irrelavant. You only need 1 bullet to kill and all guns shoot the first bullet at the same time. M12s would actually hold you back because it's not always a 1 shot kill.
These are two COMPLETELY different arguments.
1. There are no OP guns .
2. The M12s is not at all OP.
Argue them as such.SPOP should not worry you much because you hit the centre of the head anyway. HOWEVER, I will admit that it does give a competitive advantage when peaking etc (Like I said in the SPOP section). BUT, noone in this version of crossfire/nor any others, I believe have ever been able to use this to its full potential.
Basically what i'm trying to say is, there has never been someone so good/amazing that when they put on SPOP noone else can kill them because their peak time is 0.0001s faster.
SPOP peaking time is irrelevant, if anything their long leg stride gives them away faster.
What IS relevant is how SPOPs compare to snipers. SPOPs are much harder to hit with a sniper rifle, due to how thin their body is. -
These are two COMPLETELY different arguments.
1. There are no OP guns .
2. The M12s is not at all OP.
Argue them as such.
SPOP peaking time is irrelevant, if anything their long leg stride gives them away faster.
What IS relevant is how SPOPs compare to snipers. SPOPs are much harder to hit with a sniper rifle, due to how thin their body is.
I am unsure about what you are trying to tell me when you say they are different arguments. But, yes they are, they were replies to 2 different statements. However, I do agree with you on the point about there being no OP guns and M12s not being OP.
And about SPOP, I haven't thought about the leg stride and that could be an interesting point. But wouldn't the sniper rifle problem be a more pyschological problem? PRESUMING, that the hitboxes were the same
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I am unsure about what you are trying to tell me when you say they are different arguments. But, yes they are, they were replies to 2 different statements.
You and whatshisface were arguing both points in conjunction, which doesn't work.However, I do agree with you on the point about there being no OP guns and M12s not being OP.
I never said either of those things. There ARE OP guns, a belief that there aren't is blatantly ******ed.
M4 ADV anyone?And about SPOP, I haven't thought about the leg stride and that could be an interesting point. But wouldn't the sniper rifle problem be a more pyschological problem? PRESUMING, that the hitboxes were the same.
It is, that's the point. No good player shoots beside the thing they're aiming at. -
You and whatshisface were arguing both points in conjunction, which doesn't work.
I never said either of those things. There ARE OP guns, a belief that there aren't is blatantly ******ed.
M4 ADV anyone?
Well, if you were arguing that there were no OP guns, then presumably that applies to M12s? And the point I believe I was trying to make was, since the community widely assumes that M4/AK/AWM are not OP, I think none of the other guns are more OP than them, leading to there being no OP guns.
If everyone had pure aimbot (No wallhack just aimbot) and perfect reactions. This is where i'd consider how OP guns are. All the main rifles would quickly outgun everything else. There would be no discernable difference between M4 and SL or any of the 1 shot ARs out there. -
A) Believing that being killed by a camper is their fault for being noob, when in reality campers are so easy to kill, it's their own fault for not checking
Complain about being 'teamed', when the whole point of the team is so you have a team to team with
C) Linked point, complain about 'flanking', they believe that everyone should approach from in front and it's 'gay' to be killed from behind, even though it is an important tactic in online gaming and real warfare
D) Not using/complaining about certain guns. If someone manages to kill you with M12s/SL, there is no reason why they can't kill you with a different gun. Do not assume that because they are using that gun, that it is the gun they are best with. Germans fall for this one in particular, when I snipe in sniping matches, I constantly get called out to '1v1 sniper' after killing them multiple times. Those that know me however, know also that I hate and fail at sniping and the only guns I like using are M4s. It's not that I don't beat them (in fact I haven't lost yet) but it is very dangerous to assume something just because of the gun someone is using.
OH GOD SO TRUE -_- Pretty much everything in this guide is true and is the reason why decent players get kicked/flamed/trashtalked/kicked/trolled/kicked in every single pub. -
Well, if you were arguing that there were no OP guns, then presumably that applies to M12s?
Can you read? What did I JUST say?And the point I believe I was trying to make was, since the community widely assumes that M4/AK/AWM are not OP, I think none of the other guns are more OP than them, leading to there being no OP guns.
It's funny because there are plenty of guns that are stronger than the M4/AK/AWM.If everyone had pure aimbot (No wallhack just aimbot) and perfect reactions. This is where i'd consider how OP guns are. All the main rifles would quickly outgun everything else. There would be no discernable difference between M4 and SL or any of the 1 shot ARs out there.
"Hey, I hold people to an impossible standard in order to apply gunstats and then try to use it as an argument for realistic settings." -
Can you read? What did I JUST say?
It's funny because there are plenty of guns that are stronger than the M4/AK/AWM.
"Hey, I hold people to an impossible standard in order to apply gunstats and then try to use it as an argument for realistic settings."
Well, please assume that I'm rubbish at reading. I am just finding it difficult to understand your argument. Could you please explain in baby language so I can?
There aren't plenty of guns stronger than M4/AK/AWM if you imagine it in the scenario I described. Sure, there will be guns that can wallbang and some that will be silenced. But the differences would be minimal and SL/M12s/M4-adv would certainly not fall into the category of OP.
Also, "Holding people to my standard in order to apply gunstats and then try to use it as an argument for everyone elses settings." is what people are doing now. If you want to deem M4-adv as an OP weapon based on your standard, then there will obviously be people who are at a different level from you who will disagree. The most obvious thing to me was to just judge guns at the highest level. I am just proposing (what I think is) a fairer method of doing it, if you can think of a fairer method, please enlighten me. -
Henry...The M12 Is Op, End Of DiscussionWell, please assume that I'm rubbish at reading. I am just finding it difficult to understand your argument. Could you please explain in baby language so I can?
There aren't plenty of guns stronger than M4/AK/AWM if you imagine it in the scenario I described. Sure, there will be guns that can wallbang and some that will be silenced. But the differences would be minimal and SL/M12s/M4-adv would certainly not fall into the category of OP.
Also, "Holding people to my standard in order to apply gunstats and then try to use it as an argument for everyone elses settings." is what people are doing now. If you want to deem M4-adv as an OP weapon based on your standard, then there will obviously be people who are at a different level from you who will disagree. The most obvious thing to me was to just judge guns at the highest level. I am just proposing (what I think is) a fairer method of doing it, if you can think of a fairer method, please enlighten me. -
phalaenopsis wrote: »name two or more guns stronger than the AWM
name two or more rifles stronger than the AK (NA/UK version of crossfire)
Winchester , Winchester Scoped , Dual Desperado , Spas12 , Xm1014 , Xm1014 Adv , M37 , Jackhammer ( Close Range)
Problem? -
Henry you just stated an argument that is so BS to compare the guns... m12 is op , m4 and ak are rifles people been using since 10 years ago in competitive gaming's , kinda the same with the awp's , people have mastered these guns in these cf versions , like minty mastered the awp and malte mastered the ak , when you see a player with monitor offline absolutely ****tyng on these players , there's something really wrong , either is the player or the gun , and I don't think the player can gain "skill" that fast.
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I'd like to see another video except with the order reversed.I'll be surprised if anyone understands this image. But here's a potential problem with the proof video.
img
Most of the time however, there was a large difference.4:15 in the video proves that.
He goes for a head shot and just nicks the front one, then slightly adjust to the left and headshots the one behind. It was such a small adjustment that the first shot must of barely missed by a hair.ExeuntOmnes wrote: »The most logic truth: whenever you fail, you tend to blame someone else for it. It can't possibly be your fault for dying once, because of course, you are awesome, you are skilled, you never miss, you are obviously a pro. So then, it must be someone else's fault, right? Either it's a SL/M12s user, or a camper, might be a kukri noob, armor noob, spop nub kika pliz, stupid knifer kcik, f11 STAR gay, kika mini ping, mata par la parede (when u just killed a guy who was standing right in front of you), gun stealer, gatling sprayer .... any reason at all but not you. No, you are still perfect. When ret.a.rded people will stop complaining that it MUST be anyone else's fault for their own fails, CF will instantly be a better community. Also, when ret.arded people will stop acting like "king of forum", with their posts about how people shouldn't do this and that, about how people shouldn't complain on forum because it's bad, while they are doing exactly the same crying s.hit in game whenever they get killed, then definitely CF will be way better than it is right now.
This isn't meant for any of you, it's a recollection of thoughts put together as a response for the "blame others" part of the thread author.
People don't complain about weapons because they think they're amazing at this game ( most people.). It's just that some weapons, if you like it or not, do provide advantages.
In a way yes. But lets say player A has an M4 in mid on mexico, and player B has an M12s (for the sake of this situation, they're both the same skill level). If it's a CQC situation, the M12s will win most of the time, as a result of it's decent power, almost non-existent recoil, and high RoF. If that player had an M4, it'd be about a 50/50 chance of getting the kill or not.Even if they were using M12s, ofc it's your fault you died. You weren't good enough. If you instead believed it was your fault, you would eventually get better.
No, but they do provide game changeable advantages.Nuff said.
Spops/m12 etc do not make players invincible.Pink_Squirel wrote: »Except the head is only (guessing) around an inch or less when you're standing 10 feet away. The difference there (if there is one in the hitboxes) is about a 1/3 of a centimeter. Cause that third is SO much.. Plus the head of a spop shows through smoke so I see no reason to cry about it.
Just wondering but if you're such a "competitive" player, why does it bother you so much about spops and m12s? I know you don't want people pointing out about "being good enough" but if you're going to be playing competitively, you should have a reaction time fast enough to pz someone with a spop/m12s without a problem.
So just because someones a "competitive player" means they're able to 1 tap someone every time, BEFORE the other person starts shooting?Because in fact, once your skill level gets that high. Spray pattern and ROF are irrelavant. You only need 1 bullet to kill and all guns shoot the first bullet at the same time. M12s would actually hold you back because it's not always a 1 shot kill.
SPOP should not worry you much because you hit the centre of the head anyway. HOWEVER, I will admit that it does give a competitive advantage when peaking etc (Like I said in the SPOP section). BUT, noone in this version of crossfire/nor any others, I believe have ever been able to use this to its full potential.
Basically what i'm trying to say is, there has never been someone so good/amazing that when they put on SPOP noone else can kill them because their peak time is 0.0001s faster.
There are some pub players that are good enough to be a "competitive" player. The difference between alpha players and what you call competitive players isn't their shot (yes, the better players in this game have better shots, but a pub player's shot is on par with an average competitive player's.
Really? I don't remember it ever being allowed in wogl, but I could be wrong.The SPOP was once allowed in WOGL
yes_im_jelly wrote: »OH GOD SO TRUE -_- Pretty much everything in this guide is true and is the reason why decent players get kicked/flamed/trashtalked/kicked/trolled/kicked in every single pub.
One thing I wanted to point out. In your post, you're talking about alpha players. Alpha players will obviously get kicked a lot because the player base is consumed by BR's, Germans, Turks, and other places that will kick you for anything. -
lol
m12 is not really OP anymore...
I'm not saying that m12 is not better than other guns (p90, micro galil, etc.), just that most guns can beat it at long range and mid range. It also has its downsides: low ammo duration and not good for tapping to name a few.
As someone who owns most of the GP guns (thank you 1 mill win from zp crates!) I find that some GP guns are far better than the m12 -
I agree with about 85% of this guide.
The M12s and scar light are indeed overpowered.
The M12s for the reasons VATAV stated.
The scar light because it does more damage than an m4a1, has less recoil, and is still a 1 shot kill weapon.
Technically you're correct, and if you're God at this game you'll do better with a 1 shot headshot gun than an m12s, however nobody that I or you know is God at this game.
You mentioned this:
"Basically what i'm trying to say is, there has never been someone so good/amazing that when they put on SPOP noone else can kill them because their peak time is 0.0001s faster."
However the m12s situation is pretty much the same idea. The chances of someone actually doing better with for example an m4a1 over an m12s due to them being as good or better than humanly possible, is about the same chance of being able to kill someone because their peak time is 0.0001s faster.
Plain and simple, the M12s makes noobs able to get easy kills.
When people that have even a little bit of skill/decency die from an m12ser, it's annoying because without the m12s, they would have had a higher chance to beat them if the person that killed them was using a gun other than the m12s since it's so easy to use.
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