Things that need to be said and heard - Part 6
Comments
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"However, in a public game setting, WHY should I have to conform to a specific set of standards"
this in reference to using the m12 and other OP guns.
answer.. because i would hope you have a tiny bit of dignity... and a sense of fair play and sportsmanship.....
In other words.. I WOULD NEVER purchase such a gun and use it.. i would feel ashamed that i would have to rely on OP guns to get kills, if i found my self in such a way i would stop playing....
the only times i ever even pick up a m12 i run around with the trigger held down and reload and repeat. just to illustrate how OP the gun is.. I got a 4k the other day and clutch a round of Black widow doing this.
another example... Ever play Quake 2? the Hyper blaster in that game would cause server lag because the netcode was tracking each projectile and relaying that info to all players. the fire rate was crazy high and people who used it would get crazy amount of kills mainly because every one else would lag out...
WHAT happened was this, most game modes deleted the hyperblaster from the maps, and in those that did not players just stoped picking it up.... WHY? because they realized how cheap it was and made a choice not to use it...
Why this does not happen in this game in regards to OP guns i do not know. -
RendoRazor wrote: »"However, in a public game setting, WHY should I have to conform to a specific set of standards"
this in reference to using the m12 and other OP guns.
answer.. because i would hope you have a tiny bit of dignity... and a sense of fair play and sportsmanship.....
In other words.. I WOULD NEVER purchase such a gun and use it.. i would feel ashamed that i would have to rely on OP guns to get kills, if i found my self in such a way i would stop playing....
the only times i ever even pick up a m12 i run around with the trigger held down and reload and repeat. just to illustrate how OP the gun is.. I got a 4k the other day and clutch a round of Black widow doing this.
Yer but some people prefere it that way and if they do just ignore it its easy to kill someone with a spops and m12
. -
RendoRazor wrote: »"However, in a public game setting, WHY should I have to conform to a specific set of standards"
this in reference to using the m12 and other OP guns.
answer.. because i would hope you have a tiny bit of dignity... and a sense of fair play and sportsmanship.....
In other words.. I WOULD NEVER purchase such a gun and use it.. i would feel ashamed that i would have to rely on OP guns to get kills, if i found my self in such a way i would stop playing....
the only times i ever even pick up a m12 i run around with the trigger held down and reload and repeat. just to illustrate how OP the gun is.. I got a 4k the other day and clutch a round of Black widow doing this.
What about those who simply aren't that good at the game and just want to run around and have fun? Not everyone is in it for "dignity" or "pride" or "skill". Some people just want to kick back and enjoy whatever they can use. That's a crime?
Not everyone is on the same skill level. Some people just aren't that good and who are you to judge them on that? It's a free to play game. Not everyone is going to be on a level that deems them semi-skilled or better. You just have to deal with that. -
As for the spop / star, who try to shoot where there's nothing ? You don't aim for ''invisible'' hit box right ? Well, it's not like i'm against spop in a pub, i use it too from time to time. As for the star, why would an airplane hostess be in a FPS game ?
I've heard this argument as a reason why the spop/star is nooby and it really doesn't make sense to me.
You aim for the character, and since it's hitbox is still the same, the likelihood of you getting that shot is the same. -
RendoRazor wrote: »"However, in a public game setting, WHY should I have to conform to a specific set of standards"
this in reference to using the m12 and other OP guns.
answer.. because i would hope you have a tiny bit of dignity... and a sense of fair play and sportsmanship.....
In other words.. I WOULD NEVER purchase such a gun and use it.. i would feel ashamed that i would have to rely on OP guns to get kills, if i found my self in such a way i would stop playing....
the only times i ever even pick up a m12 i run around with the trigger held down and reload and repeat. just to illustrate how OP the gun is.. I got a 4k the other day and clutch a round of Black widow doing this.
another example... Ever play Quake 2? the Hyper blaster in that game would cause server lag because the netcode was tracking each projectile and relaying that info to all players. the fire rate was crazy high and people who used it would get crazy amount of kills mainly because every one else would lag out...
WHAT happened was this, most game modes deleted the hyperblaster from the maps, and in those that did not players just stoped picking it up.... WHY? because they realized how cheap it was and made a choice not to use it...
Why this does not happen in this game in regards to OP guns i do not know.
Rarely do I see someone with an m12 doing very well anyways. If you get killed by an OP gun its because you let it happen. I have no problem killing someone with an m12 you just have to know how to play against one.
Its called tactics. -
Also, that is the kind of attitude that I'm talking about. Users are ACTUALLY worried about their "dignity" or "image" in a public game.
.... WHY?
Public games are for messing around and having fun. Sure, a lot of people are here to improve their skill and there is no harm in that. But, the MAIN purpose for public games, especially in a free to play game/community, is to have fun. Who remembers Closed/Open Beta? Who EVER cared about what people were using?
Like I said, only when a "competitive standard" came into play, is when people started caring about what was being used in a public game. The character or weapon does NOT make the player. A weapon does NOT affect your aim or your tactics or individual skill. An experienced player, as it has been shown, usually has no problem taking care of people using these weapons or characters. Public games are for the public. Period.
Just for clarification, I'm not saying a competitive standard is bad. But, there needs to be a difference between casual gaming and competitive gaming. The line is being blurred and normal players who do not want to compete are getting ridiculed for using weapons deemed OP by aspiring competitive players or actual competitive players in public games. What happened to simply having fun? -
[MOD]Polleus wrote: »Also, that is the kind of attitude that I'm talking about. Users are ACTUALLY worried about their "dignity" or "image" in a public game.
.... WHY?
Public games are for messing around and having fun. Sure, a lot of people are here to improve their skill and there is no harm in that. But, the MAIN purpose for public games, especially in a free to play game/community, is to have fun. Who remembers Closed/Open Beta? Who EVER cared about what people were using?
Like I said, only when a "competitive standard" came into play, is when people started caring about what was being used in a public game. The character or weapon does NOT make the player. A weapon does NOT affect your aim or your tactics or individual skill. An experienced player, as it has been shown, usually has no problem taking care of people using these weapons or characters. Public games are for the public. Period.
Just for clarification, I'm not saying a competitive standard is bad. But, there needs to be a difference between casual gaming and competitive gaming. The line is being blurred and normal players who do not want to compete are getting ridiculed for using weapons deemed OP by aspiring competitive players or actual competitive players in public games. What happened to simply having fun?
Whats sad is 90% of the games I play in I see someone using m12.(keep in mind I dont care what gun they use) And then I will see people spamming "kick m12 noob" and half they time they get kicked. Just another reason the kick vote is abused. The community isnt that terrible but its no where near perfect. The community just needs to grow up(literally as most are under 18).
BTW what does oL stand for? -
I wonder if there was a way to have a select channel or server that is WOGL rules. I know we have that echo crud where u cant use spop... But if there was a server or channel(s) that had WOGL-type rules, I wonder if that would help with those who don't want to face against m12 idiots who think they own the place because they know how to pull a trigger.
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I wonder if there was a way to have a select channel or server that is WOGL rules. I know we have that echo crud where u cant use spop... But if there was a server or channel(s) that had WOGL-type rules, I wonder if that would help with those who don't want to face against m12 idiots who think they own the place because they know how to pull a trigger.
Dont get mad about an OP gun. You have to learn to play against it.
To be honest I think people made E8 because they are scared of OP guns and they cant handle killing someone with one. -
Well said, sir. I especially think this whole SPOP, STAR, psychological advantage argument is "iffy".[MOD]Polleus wrote: »I believe it's long overdue that I have written one of these up. I think the Community needs a little discussion and controversy for the day I'm going to touch on a sensitive subject, so let's keep the discussion clean and non-offensive. I CAN and WILL remove or infract anyone for taking the subject off-topic and/or deliberately starting a flame war/insulting users for their comments.
End rant. Discuss. Don't flame. Don't insult. Keep it civil, or I will act accordingly.
If you are aiming for the character and the hit boxes are the same, then I don't see what the problem is. -
I went through the first few pages but i'm not gonna sift through all 14. I'll just go ahead and throw in my two cents (people probably already said what i'm saying but who cares).
Publicly I use the Star Character.
A pub is a pub and there's not really any reason to try and maintain any image in one.
Plus majority of the people in pubs are of another nationality and the chances of them speaking English are less than 15-20%. Of course this topic isn't about that though.
In competitive matches I don't use any of the female characters or unapproved weapons.
Anyway!
The flaw in your argument itself on the female characters having the same hitboxes is well.. flawed. Nobody is gonna aim at an "invisible" hitbox they CANNOT see. So saying it has the same hitbox isn't a very good argument. I do, however, agree with allowing people to use them in pubs. Yeah people paid for it so they should be able to use it. That's fine either way because I use them in pubs as well. Personally I have no problem at all hitting Spops or Stars. Anyone who has a problem doing so needs to stop crying, man-up and take some target practice. The illusion that you're shooting a smaller target really does help when it comes to killing the male characters.
Onto the scarlight, m12, etc.
I can agree with you.
I have no problem with the m12. I used it when it came out for about a month then sold it. People who use the m12 don't bother me & I troll people who use the Scarlight for fun. If you see someone then go for the first damn shot. It doesn't matter what gun they have. If you don't kill them that's your problem (unless lag is playing a factor).
People could argue about these types of things for days. -
Dont get mad about an OP gun. You have to learn to play against it.
To be honest I think people made E8 because they are scared of OP guns and they cant handle killing someone with one.
Well as basic "taining" so-to-speak for future WOGL players... You're never gonna face someone with an m12 in a competative field... So I was wondering if there was a server or channel(s) that can be implimented into CF so those who don't want to play against extremly OP guns, can actually strategize and AIM. Instead of having to get pelted by 20 bullets from a lagger or a farmer.
I don't mind killing idiots who use a m12. I killed someone who was using an m12with a Winchester... I just don't want to do that EVERY SINGLE GAME that I enter. I'm not afraid of m12 or SL, I'm just a bit tired of having to face them in every single match. -
Well as basic "taining" so-to-speak for future WOGL players... You're never gonna face someone with an m12 in a competative field... So I was wondering if there was a server or channel(s) that can be implimented into CF so those who don't want to play against extremly OP guns, can actually strategize and AIM. Instead of having to get pelted by 20 bullets from a lagger or a farmer.
I don't mind killing idiots who use a m12. I killed someone who was using an m12with a Winchester... I just don't want to do that EVERY SINGLE GAME that I enter. I'm not afraid of m12 or SL, I'm just a bit tired of having to face them in every single match.
See to me playing against someone with an m12 will make you better faster than playing against normal weapons. Since they have an "advantage" you have to make up for that with your own skill. -
The flaw in your argument itself on the female characters having the same hitboxes is well.. flawed. Nobody is gonna aim at an "invisible" hitbox they CANNOT see.
But they are gonna aim for what they can see and the likelihood that they'll hit it is the same, as I've already said but it was mostly ignored. -
true again, agree totally!!
These guys calling people noobs for using a scar or the m12 are just weak,..
Remember my first days of CF,I keep being killed by every1,...Just do not take seriously those offense,take your D.E. and show them how can u really play even with a handgun against their m4a1.
I personally think that all fire arms in CF are great, u need just to practice like for a few days and after u master the weapon it can be good as any other.
Last month I unwillingly repaired my M16 lol and I use it,works perfectly,like any other GP or ZP weapon,...so guys if u had a bad day or just u can't kill nothing on the moment go out with your friends, take a walk, watch TV,leave it 4 the next day
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Exactly. Is it harder to hit a smaller target? Yes. But in this case the "true" target isn't actually smaller. If you aim for the character and miss by a little, there is still a possibility that you will hit the player.RedSplatter wrote: »But they are gonna aim for what they can see and the likelihood that they'll hit it is the same, as I've already said but it was mostly ignored. -
Rarely do I see someone with an m12 doing very well anyways. If you get killed by an OP gun its because you let it happen. I have no problem killing someone with an m12 you just have to know how to play against one.
Its called tactics.
k, put a m12 or any other high fire rate gun in the hands a of kid with 170-200+ ping and u got a real pain in the ass, Why? because the netcode is so broken they can fire at you for a good 2 secs before it ever bothers showing up that they have even pulled the trigger... what happens is you see a br, fire a quick few rounds at his head, then hear a fking tidal wave of m12 bullets all at once and die, to learn that you did no damage because he had "apparently" already been around the corner shooting at you before he even showed up on your screen.. this issue is of course "fixed" when low or normal pingers use a m12, or if the high pingers are using a lower firerate gun. but it is still SUPER anoying.
"Originally Posted by [MOD]Polleus View Post
Also, that is the kind of attitude that I'm talking about. Users are ACTUALLY worried about their "dignity" or "image" in a public game.
.... WHY?"
WTH man, its a competitive game. the very nature of it (cept for maybe mm and HM) is about competing... its about wanting to win over losing...
and i am sorry if i value dignity and honor in game... It is the way it started out. you respected good players back in the day (early 90's) and you strived to be as good as them. it matters, as much as anything in a game can matter, how good you are and fair and well you play... Just because this day in age online video games are filled with ignorant console raised noobs who are used to putting a disc in and hitting play while the auto aim and magnetic crosshairs hold their hands, kids who dont even UNDERSTAND PING,
or the concept of respecting those that are better then them. DOES NOT MEAN i can't hope for a return culture shift back to a more civilized gaming community. FOR ****S sake i played quake 2 for nearly 2 years and never once saw a hack. and hardly ever ended a game with out EVERY PLAYER saying GG at the end of the round. can you imagine? -
my 2 cents
Spop: Few advantages but advantages nonetheless,for example, you aim for the character not the invisible hitbox surrounding the character. Spops smaller therefore a smaller target to hit and they can peak certain areas without being seen.
OP Guns: 25% the gun 75% the player right? In this instance,no! The scar light,and m12 are the only guns i will ever complain about because they go by 50% the gun 50% the player. What im trying to say is that these guns throw off the balance of the game and some nerfs would really be nice. If you are looking for respect in the competitive community you shall get none wielding these weapons of horror. And for those saying" only reason ppl hate the skill light is because wogl" your WRONG! the scar light has been frowned upon before wogl but since everyone was using it they had to counter their opponents scar light with their very own.
Competitiveness and public room rules: I dont mind seeing spops,stars,and op weapons in pubs since i respect the fact that people that have these items more than likely support the game by buying zp,but do not go into e-8 and ***** about being kicked for using them. E-8 is like a practice server where the competitive part of the community goes to practice wogl rules,esl rules or any other league. Theres other servers out there for you all that are complaining about getting kicked for using an wogl banned item and the other servers usually have more people,so you dont have to be in e-8. i dont know what else i missed but anyways im too lazy to type anymore. -
RendoRazor wrote: »k, put a m12 or any other high fire rate gun in the hands a of kid with 170-200+ ping and u got a real pain in the ass, Why? because the netcode is so broken they can fire at you for a good 2 secs before it ever bothers showing up that they have even pulled the trigger... what happens is you see a br, fire a quick few rounds at his head, then hear a fking tidal wave of m12 bullets all at once and die, to learn that you did no damage because he had "apparently" already been around the corner shooting at you before he even showed up on your screen.. this issue is of course "fixed" when low or normal pingers use a m12, or if the high pingers are using a lower firerate gun. but it is still SUPER anoying.
"Originally Posted by [MOD]Polleus View Post
Also, that is the kind of attitude that I'm talking about. Users are ACTUALLY worried about their "dignity" or "image" in a public game.
.... WHY?"
WTH man, its a competitive game. the very nature of it (cept for maybe mm and HM) is about competing... its about wanting to win over losing...
and i am sorry if i value dignity and honor in game... It is the way it started out. you respected good players back in the day (early 90's) and you strived to be as good as them. it matters, as much as anything in a game can matter, how good you are and fair and well you play... Just because this day in age online video games are filled with ignorant console raised noobs who are used to putting a disc in and hitting play while the auto aim and magnetic crosshairs hold their hands, kids who dont even UNDERSTAND PING,
or the concept of respecting those that are better then them. DOES NOT MEAN i can't hope for a return culture shift back to a more civilized gaming community. FOR ****S sake i played quake 2 for nearly 2 years and never once saw a hack. and hardly ever ended a game with out EVERY PLAYER saying GG at the end of the round. can you imagine?
deep sh1t right here. -
RendoRazor wrote: »k, put a m12 or any other high fire rate gun in the hands a of kid with 170-200+ ping and u got a real pain in the ass, Why? because the netcode is so broken they can fire at you for a good 2 secs before it ever bothers showing up that they have even pulled the trigger... what happens is you see a br, fire a quick few rounds at his head, then hear a fking tidal wave of m12 bullets all at once and die, to learn that you did no damage because he had "apparently" already been around the corner shooting at you before he even showed up on your screen.. this issue is of course "fixed" when low or normal pingers use a m12, or if the high pingers are using a lower firerate gun. but it is still SUPER anoying.
Been there and done that.... That wave of bullets would happen with any gun they use. Not just the m12. -
Been there and done that.... That wave of bullets would happen with any gun they use. Not just the m12.
its really not that hard to understand, apparently sense u seem to be agreeing with me but also disagreeing at the same time....
AS I SAID, a lower fire rate gun would mean that they fire 4 rounds in this magical "u can;t see me but im infront of u shooting" time. as aposed to a whole clip of the m12... sense most of them can't aim, more then half of their low fire rate bullets would miss, and you would take a little dmg and get the kill.. but taken half a clip of m12 rounds will bring you down to 0 before it even shows that they are even shooting. thus it is WAY MORE ANNOYING AND NEEDS SOMTHING DONE ABOUT IT -
RendoRazor wrote: »its really not that hard to understand, apparently sense u seem to be agreeing with me but also disagreeing at the same time....
AS I SAID, a lower fire rate gun would mean that they fire 4 rounds in this magical "u can;t see me but im infront of u shooting" time. as aposed to a whole clip of the m12... sense most of them can't aim, more then half of their low fire rate bullets would miss, and you would take a little dmg and get the kill.. but taken half a clip of m12 rounds will bring you down to 0 before it even shows that they are even shooting. thus it is WAY MORE ANNOYING AND NEEDS SOMTHING DONE ABOUT IT
Sounds like someone is getting all worked up. You cant charge an m12 user. Sit back and let them get some low hp and they are no prob. not all m12 users cant aim. Thats not why they use it. No matter what gun you use you still have to aim.
Its used because it performs. -
Indeed Polleus[MOD]Polleus wrote: »Why? It's a public game. Public games are for using what the game has to offer. That includes EVERYTHING. There is no rule that says I can't use a Scar Light in a public match. The player makes the shot, not the gun.
Let me give an example
If I give a Scar Light to a rookie that just started he will be killed immediately even though he/she has the SL that is considered OP
Scar light is unstoppable is in the hands of an expertised M4A1 or AK-47 user.
A rookie will die easily even with M12s
A decent MP5 will take the M12s and own everyone
It's the gun not the player
As for the SPOP/STAR issue
The difference is small
Hitboxes are the same so what's the issue?
The ones that go competitive are considered decent-very good players
What sort of decent player are you if you can't kill someone
Spray pattern affect you shot anyway
As for the snipers...
Well they have super accuracy.
Yo can aim and bring them down quickly
Considering that if you join a server you will find way more pubs than Competitive matches it means that the large majprity of CF is playing just for fun
They have the right to use anything they paid for
So...
You can do anything in CF unless it's limited by rules (ToS,WOGL,ESL etc)
QQing about guns or characters seems pretty pathetic to me -
Hypernamer2 wrote: »Indeed Polleus
Let me give an example
If I give a Scar Light to a rookie that just started he will be killed immediately even though he/she has the SL that is considered OP
Scar light is unstoppable is in the hands of an expertised M4A1 or AK-47 user.
A rookie will die easily even with M12s
A decent MP5 will take the M12s and own everyone
It's the gun not the player
As for the SPOP/STAR issue
The difference is small
Hitboxes are the same so what's the issue?
The ones that go competitive are considered decent-very good players
What sort of decent player are you if you can't kill someone
Spray pattern affect you shot anyway
As for the snipers...
Well they have super accuracy.
Yo can aim and bring them down quickly
Considering that if you join a server you will find way more pubs than Competitive matches it means that the large majprity of CF is playing just for fun
They have the right to use anything they paid for
So...
You can do anything in CF unless it's limited by rules (ToS,WOGL,ESL etc)
QQing about guns or characters seems pretty pathetic to me
Did you say that backwards?
Its the player not the gun. -
The slimmer characters have a physical advantage, when peeking around a corner, they see you for that split second and therefore, gives you a disadvantage. The SCAR Light and M12s both need nerfing. End of story.
Besides what I just said, I completely agree with Polleus that public games ARE PUBLIC GAMES, and you can use anything you want. Insulting people using the "noob" weapons just makes you look like a unsocial person who takes a game way too seriously.
![[MOD]Polleus](https://forum.z8games.com/uploads/customavatars/7/navatar_8918107.gif){kind=avatar}
some people use these "noob guns" for fun. Expeacially when people just sit and cry cause of what there using. 
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