Dedicated server question. GMs advise.
Comments
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Now that I read the last post Loki made on that thread, I completely understand what he is saying. The lack of information on the thread here wasn't much help to understanding what is going on.
Vertex, you are a very misleading person :P.
The servers we all know and love here are Meta Servers, and this is what all the information for the game is stored on. The are no true dedicated servers, to my understanding.
I'm still a little fuzzy on the whole p2p controversy though. This still hasn't been cleared up.
If what Loki is saying is true then wouldnt us NA players lag like crazy ****s if a BR hosted anyways? -
Now that I read the last post Loki made on that thread, I completely understand what he is saying. The lack of information on the thread here wasn't much help to understanding what is going on.
Vertex, you are a very misleading person :P.
The servers we all know and love here are Meta Servers, and this is what all the information for the game is stored on. The are no true dedicated servers, to my understanding.
I'm still a little fuzzy on the whole p2p controversy though. This still hasn't been cleared up.
If you look when you login, XFire detects you as connecting to a Korean Server. But once youre connected to a server, it displays a Canadian IP. Therefore showing that the game servers ARE in Canada,
Now the servers are NOT dedicated servers.. at least in the view of what people may think dedicated servers are. i.e Counter Strike's servers etc.
I still dont understand why Loki said it was a Peer-To-Peer game. It doesnt make senseMaybe we are, just that the "ping" value is gathered from the users ping to the server, not the peer hosting the room.
It'll be interesting to get G4s side of this for sure!
What server? If it was a P2P game then there would be no server involved. -
Sounds like you're just trying to quote Loki
I wasn't quoting anyone. Those were my own words.
I recognized that in a previous post, but, as Loki says, that is the Meta server.[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »If you look when you login, XFire detects you as connecting to a Korean Server. But once youre connected to a server, it displays a Canadian IP. Therefore showing that the game servers ARE in Canada,
I'm not trying to argue for the sake of arguing, I'm trying to understand as much as any of you are.
He says Meta Server, I say prove him wrong.
Any evidence would be helpful. This thread is just full of "your word versus mine". -
Well theres always servers involved, in our case, the servers the map data etc is stored on, and channels (and most likely rooms of course).
Map/weapon data is on your pc.You wouldnt be connecting to a server in Peer-To-Peer system as that defeats the point of using P2P.
The fact we have a server list and channels kinda gives it away that we are connecting to a server. -
Well theres always servers involved, in our case, the servers the map data etc is stored on, and channels (and most likely rooms of course).
Yes. The question is whether Crossfire has "meta" servers or "dedicated servers".
Meta server = Hosts player stats, items, maps, ect but the actual game is peer-to-peer for player movements and firing.
Dedicated server = Hosts everything and you never need to connect to a peer. This is what crossfire has... right guys? -
[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »The fact we have a server list and channels kinda gives it away that we are connecting to a server.
Not exactly. PB has the same server/channel interface, but as soon as you are in game, the room host is the server. This is called a listen server. SGI seems to think Crossfire uses this same setup. Seeing as how Smilegate helped MAKE CROSSFIRE, these statements are very troubling. -
I wasn't quoting anyone. Those were my own words.
I recognized that in a previous post, but, as Loki says, that is the Meta server.
I'm not trying to argue for the sake of arguing, I'm trying to understand as much as any of you are.
He says Meta Server, I say prove him wrong.
Any evidence would be helpful. This thread is just full of "your word versus mine".
That being the server list, storage list etc etc.
Where you are physically playing are the game servers hosted in Canada. Which still supports me in saying that this is a Client/Server game... NOT Peer-To-Peer -
[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »That being the server list, storage list etc etc.
Where you are physically playing are the game servers hosted in Canada. Which still supports me in saying that this is a Client/Server game... NOT Peer-To-Peer
Ok I understand now. Thank you, oh prestigious one. -
Not exactly. PB has the same server/channel interface, but as soon as you are in game, the room host is the server. This is called a listen server. SGI seems to think Crossfire uses this same setup. Seeing as how Smilegate helped MAKE CROSSFIRE, these statements are very troubling.
Ok you have a point.
I havent played PB yet, but the basic point stands. How on earth can this game be a Peer-To-Peer game when you ARE connecting to a server and the pings to the server, not the host (since you arent connecting to the host), being displayed? -
Not to mention it feels like you're connected to a server and plays like your connected to a server regardless of whoever is in your room, even if they're all in europe or brazil.[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »Ok you have a point.
I havent played PB yet, but the basic point stands. How on earth can this game be a Peer-To-Peer game when you ARE connecting to a server and the pings to the server, not the host (since you arent connecting to the host), being displayed?
Also the fact that hosts can drop at will without any hint of a sudden lag change or the need for the game to pause for a host change should kinda give that away too. -
[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »If you look when you login, XFire detects you as connecting to a Korean Server. But once youre connected to a server, it displays a Canadian IP. Therefore showing that the game servers ARE in Canada,
Now the servers are NOT dedicated servers.. at least in the view of what people may think dedicated servers are. i.e Counter Strike's servers etc.
I still dont understand why Loki said it was a Peer-To-Peer game. It doesnt make sense
I just confirmed the Korean Server - Canadian Server Switch Giggle FTW!(just the be sure on that I had never noticed before)
So, since its not a dedicated server in the sense as we know a dedicated server to be. Does this mean that they are special boxes or something? Ones the "customer/user" cannot play with, but still dedicated to the game correct? -
Not to mention it feels like you're connected to a server and plays like your connected to a server regardless of whoever is in your room, even if they're all in europe or brazil.
Also the fact that hosts can drop at will without any hint of a sudden lag change or the need for the game to pause for a host change should kinda give that away too.
And the face that my ping is consistently the same for 2 years.... chances are im connecting to the same place everytime... the Canadian Servers... -
I just confirmed the Korean Server - Canadian Server Switch Giggle FTW!(just the be sure on that I had never noticed before)
So, since its not a dedicated server in the sense as we know a dedicated server to be. Does this mean that they are special boxes or something? Ones the "customer/user" cannot play with, but still dedicated to the game correct?
Told you.
Most people know dedicated servers as what games like COD4, CSS use. That was what I meant.
Obviously Crossfire doesnt use that type of system -
They can call it a peer-to-peer game all they want, it will not make it true.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, smells like a duck and acts like a duck, it's a duck.
If it truly was the case, a Brazilian or U.K player would not have a problem playing on the Canadian servers.
The sheer ludicrousness of the 'representative's statement' is absurd. There are obviously some internal (or external) conflicts going on, and to put it bluntly, the kid is mad.
Trying to cover up a p2p game as a dedicated server would be like trying to pretend a dog is a neko. -
The korean server is the login server. The canadian servers are the actual game servers. They're all linked to database servers somewhere else (could be korea, could be canada, idk). That really doesn't matter much what the servers do for stat tracking though.I just confirmed the Korean Server - Canadian Server Switch Giggle FTW!(just the be sure on that I had never noticed before)
So, since its not a dedicated server in the sense as we know a dedicated server to be. Does this mean that they are special boxes or something? Ones the "customer/user" cannot play with, but still dedicated to the game correct?
The fact is that the games are -hosted- on those canadian servers. Not on a player computer's (as would happen in a p2p). If the game was truly p2p, the game would have to pause every time a host leaves (to move the "server" to a new player), the lag would change every time that happens, and the lag in -any- game would be 200+ ping because people's residential internets are -not- meant for running servers and aren't (usually) near enough to an internet backbone to provide anything within 100 ping for anyone. The host would also have the lowest ping in the room by far, with at most a 2 ping (unless it shows the ping the host gets to the actual canadian server, but the game would still play as if that person was on lan). -
They can call it a peer-to-peer game all they want, it will not make it true.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, smells like a duck and acts like a duck, it's a duck.
Exactly what I said...
Loki is now fighting a losing battle. They are wrong... very wrong. Yet, are still trying to bulls*** us with all this P2P rubbish. There is NO possible way this game is in any way Peer-To-Peer. Fact.
I wanna know who Loki spoke to.. if at all. If so, they were clearly messing with Loki or were clearly as ignorant as Loki is -
G2Wolf, this isn't a knowledge war.
The question wasn't about how the host/dedi/meta/p2p servers worked, it was which were in place.
The real underlying question was basically, 'Why is a representative of SG giving false information?'
The game runs on dedicated servers, no question about it. -
So i watch v3rtex connect to a game, he gets a 2-3 bar connection (bad) and this IP shows up in Xfire, so I trace it using the free site...
http://www.ip-adress.com/ip_tracer/38.106.86.21
Now, I dont know about you, but Being in MA, shouldnt he get ALOT BETTER than a 3bar connection to D.C.? I mean, playing with people in Florida he gets 4-5 bars(good) and Cali- gets 3 bars off of him. -
The real underlying question was basically, 'Why is a representative of SG giving false information?'
The game runs on dedicated servers, no question about it.
Exactly. Im beginning to think that they DIDNT contact a SG representative. If they truely were, they wouldnt have given such incorrect information. -
So i watch v3rtex connect to a game, he gets a 2-3 bar connection (bad) and this IP shows up in Xfire, so I trace it using the free site...
http://www.ip-adress.com/ip_tracer/38.106.86.21
Now, I dont know about you, but Being in MA, shouldnt he get ALOT BETTER than a 3bar connection to D.C.? I mean, playing with people in Florida he gets 4-5 bars(good) and Cali- gets 3 bars off of him.
Remember when players from the U.K were being routed to Canada and then to the U.K server? Probably just some bad routing tables. -
[MOD]Giggletron wrote: »Exactly. Im beginning to think that they DIDNT contact a SG representative. If they truely were, they wouldnt have given such incorrect information.
That's why this is so terrible. GM Loki *is* an SG representative. He claims his superiors told him this. -
That's why this is so terrible. GM Loki *is* an SG representative. He claims his superiors told him this.
No hes a SGI representative. He isnt at the parent company.. He isnt a developer.
He CLAIMS to have been told this. If a develeoper at SmileGate truely told him this, then why did he say its a P2P game when it obviously isnt -
OH GAWD HERE IS BRUCE TO ASSIST:
Go download project Blackout and play it. (OH GAWD HES PROMOTING ANOTHER GAME)
When you're host, your ping is zero and you have all sorts of advantages in terms of peeking, quickswitching, etc. When you're not host you can't really quickswitch, your shots take forever to reg, etc.
tl;dr Any game that uses the p2p model with a host will never be competitive because one player will always have a super advantage and some players will be at a disadvantage. -
Hrm, what if its more outside the box? As even those with high pings reg better at times than those with low pings.
What if the case is that instead of it pinging just the host, what if the game is actually pinging everyone in the room for connectivity? It would make sense since some people would register better than others. And why laggers tank severely when they should be getting owned for their lack of registration to 'the server'. Most games I've see with dedicated servers almost ALWAYS favour the low pingers, where tanking is never an issue.
Perhaps they cheat, like WoW the actual server side functionality is EXTREMELY small, and the rest is based on the other player's pings and computer hardware. I think CF is runnign the exact same thing.
After all, it would make sense why the room laggs incredibly when there's tons of people in the room.
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