CrossFire Ban List.
Hello CrossFire Community
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What about a Ban List?
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positive points:
-Players can see how many cheaters got busted.
-It does not take a long time to make a ban list.
- The players will see cheaters get banned.
-It can motivate players to report.
-Cheaters will get scared.
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negative points:
-It won't solve the hacking situation.
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Thanks to [Annomader for this namecard. To bad i can't use it in my signature!!!
Comments
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+9000
Although I know it kinda puts a bad outlook on the banned players, lets face it CF NA is just a bit (and i mean a lot) ignorant of the whole hacking situation. Name and shame em!!!
I know Crossfire SEA posts the banned people on facebook and awards reporters 5k GP.DualRainbows wrote: »That's hilarious. I'm actually currently thinking of working on this: http://banlist.cf/
Wanna divide up the work? You do the graphics. I do the programming?
PM me.
EDIT: I need your IP to whitelist you. Otherwise you're just going to get a maintenance page
omg me plz pick me pick me
I'm willing to help. I may not know much about programming but I'm willing to learn and I've had some coding expieriences before *cought* minecrap *cough* -
Stargyptian wrote: »+9000
Although I know it kinda puts a bad outlook on the banned players, lets face it CF NA is just a bit (and i mean a lot) ignorant of the whole hacking situation. Name and shame em!!!
\
its not a bad outlook because people who "hack" will be known to player. There the ones that didnt read the rules of Z8 games terms and usage. Beside it shows GM actually banning people.(your not, 100% sure back then because it didnt say "ban" unless you logged onto the account)
Overall agreed
+21 -
The normal answer is that it takes time to maintain a list which would serve no purpose other than to expose cheaters which entices flamewars everywhere.
So, time better spent elsewhere no doubt.
thanks dot
There's a thread (somewhere out there), but frankly I can't find it. God bless forums.
If there is no purpose, then there is no reason to have a ban list. What's real is that they banned over 20,000 accounts since November 1st. This is not a lie, they worked to clean up the game.
A pretty big telltale here. I'm not one to go for a 200-kill mission in egypt td if there are cheaters. What's important to note is that we do not need to know who cheated, they don't have to show you anything because they're not required. Plus, I can ensure you that there are far more important things that they should be dedicating time towards. -
So basically the banlist that I had initially thought of relates to the Community-Based Report System thread that I had posted. Players will be able to submit their cfr files and I'll soon be working on developing an algorithm that will be using AI to detect non-intrinsic behaviour. Although it won't be able to detect wall hackers, it will be able to detect aim-botters as well as macro users; which are by far the most annoying cheats out there. Once the algorithm has determined whether or not a player is cheating, it'll give the uploader an option to publish the cheater to the banlist for other players to see. I'm hoping on making the evidence public as well.
This might be a complicated journey but it's certainly doable. It's helpful how recently AI has become a fairly hot topic and even Google has started acquiring AI companies like Nest Labs and DeepMind. I know that it seems that all this effort I'm putting might just go to waste, but my main goal in developing banlist is to complement the CS/Math classes I'm currently taking in university and hopefully it'll be a nice learning experience as well as be a benefit to the CF community.
As of now, I'm currently reverse engineering the .cfr file types that CF uses to store the replay data. Once I have that, everything should just involve an application of what I'm learning in university.
TL;DR: Just me ranting on about how banlist isn't exactly "useless"; to me at least
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Stargyptian wrote: »omg me plz pick me pick me
I'm willing to help. I may not know much about programming but I'm willing to learn and I've had some coding expieriences before *cought* minecrap *cough*
I'll probably be needing someone to give me a bunch of replay files. I might open up the site during christmas for people to submit cfr files. 1 valid cfr file = 1 point.
And I'll be using these points to hold a giveaway
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They had a thread a long time ago that had every hacker who had been banned listed in it. They had to take it down for legal reasons.
That being said, if you tried to post your own website with a ban list, they would be fully within their rights to have it removed and taken down. And they probably would. -
They had a thread a long time ago that had every hacker who had been banned listed in it. They had to take it down for legal reasons.
That being said, if you tried to post your own website with a ban list, they would be fully within their rights to have it removed and taken down. And they probably would.
How is it illegal? Unless your IGN is a registered trademark (with you being the trademark holder), there is nothing illegal with me posting it in a public listing.
Heck, are you saying that everytime I use the words Tim Hortons on my blog, I'm going to get sued? That's totally ridiculous. -
DualRainbows wrote: »How is it illegal? Unless your IGN is a registered trademark (with you being the trademark holder), there is nothing illegal with me posting it in a public listing.
Heck, are you saying that everytime I use the words Tim Hortons on my blog, I'm going to get sued? That's totally ridiculous.
Just listing names isn't going to do a thing. To fully recognize a user, you would use their USN which is unquie to each account. The issue with that is that USN is part of Z8Games. Since Z8 owns all of the accounts in CF then they have the full right to come after those that are listing those accounts as banned. Unless they authorize it, I doubt anything can be done.
The only way to see if someone is banned is if they are banned from a league such as ESL or ESG. Their league accounts are linked to their USN for monitoring purposes. The downside is if ESL or ESG bans you, that doesn't mean you're banned from CF, just the league itself. The leagues however can submit bans that came from their clients to Z8 for further ingame action. -
Just listing names isn't going to do a thing. To fully recognize a user, you would use their USN which is unquie to each account. The issue with that is that USN is part of Z8Games. Since Z8 owns all of the accounts in CF then they have the full right to come after those that are listing those accounts as banned. Unless they authorize it, I doubt anything can be done.
The only way to see if someone is banned is if they are banned from a league such as ESL or ESG. Their league accounts are linked to their USN for monitoring purposes. The downside is if ESL or ESG bans you, that doesn't mean you're banned from CF, just the league itself. The leagues however can submit bans that came from their clients to Z8 for further ingame action.
I see where you're getting at. I guess an analogy to this is if I had 3 kids and someone labelled them as being "bad" in the newspaper. Then I being their parents would have the right to sue the news press for defamation; given that I can prove what the newspaper said was false.
I guess we'll just have to wait until Monday to hear from a GM if whether or not this "banlist" is allowed. -
I believe I've already submitted a reply.
There was a ban list back in 2009, it was removed a few months later. Why? Because they felt it was pointless. They currently have a "ban result tool" available to the themselves, that's how I know that 20,000+ accounts were banned this month. As much as that goes, the list would never appear publicly for the general community.
For various reasons, it's not going to be shown. Your IGN and USN do belong under a trademark known as Smilegate. These accounts do not belong to you, who and why a player is banned is none of your business. If this was your game and you owned rights to it, you would be entitled to operate on such project under the proper resources (which you do not have permission for and own). -
[MOD]Fizzeq wrote: »I believe I've already submitted a reply.
There was a ban list back in 2009, it was removed a few months later. Why? Because they felt it was pointless. They currently have a "ban result tool" available to the themselves, that's how I know that 20,000+ accounts were banned this month. As much as that goes, the list would never appear publicly for the general community.
For various reasons, it's not going to be shown. Your IGN and USN do belong under a trademark known as Smilegate. These accounts do not belong to you, who and why a player is banned is none of your business. If this was your game and you owned rights to it, you would be entitled to operate on such project under the proper resources (which you do not have permission for and own).
Oh nho! Does dat mean dat my account is exposed to Junixbox godly powers?
QQ gg wp -
[MOD]Fizzeq wrote: »I believe I've already submitted a reply.
There was a ban list back in 2009, it was removed a few months later. Why? Because they felt it was pointless. They currently have a "ban result tool" available to the themselves, that's how I know that 20,000+ accounts were banned this month. As much as that goes, the list would never appear publicly for the general community.
For various reasons, it's not going to be shown. Your IGN and USN do belong under a trademark known as Smilegate. These accounts do not belong to you, who and why a player is banned is none of your business. If this was your game and you owned rights to it, you would be entitled to operate on such project under the proper resources (which you do not have permission for and own).
Well that says it all. Plus, the ban list will only cause more rage on the forum. We already get 'why am I banned' threads, next we'll see I want my name removed because that was back in 2009...and let the stories begin! -
[MOD]Fizzeq wrote: »I believe I've already submitted a reply.
There was a ban list back in 2009, it was removed a few months later. Why? Because they felt it was pointless. They currently have a "ban result tool" available to the themselves, that's how I know that 20,000+ accounts were banned this month. As much as that goes, the list would never appear publicly for the general community.
For various reasons, it's not going to be shown. Your IGN and USN do belong under a trademark known as Smilegate. These accounts do not belong to you, who and why a player is banned is none of your business. If this was your game and you owned rights to it, you would be entitled to operate on such project under the proper resources (which you do not have permission for and own).
I'm pretty sure trademarks are authorized under the government and not privately-owned companies. You can't just come up with a name and say that it's trademarked; that's not exactly how it works. The only registered trademarks owned by CF as a whole (for the NA region) are: "Smilegate West", "Smilegate Entertainment", "Z8Games", "Lost Saga", and "CrossFire". If all the account names registered on CrossFire were trademarked, that would cost them a fortune.
Here's where you're probably getting confused. If I am a trademark holder and I register an account on CrossFire using my trademark as the account name, then Z8 now owns the rights to use my trademark for whatever purposes they had stated in their agreement.
So imagine if I signed up my IGN as Tim_Hortons and for some reason Z8 uses my IGN in their announcement(s). If the real trademark holder of "Tim Hortons" wanted to file a complaint, Z8 could "protect" themselves by saying that they thought the account holder owned the trademark; and that's when I would get in trouble. That's why you can't just use the FG tag if you're not partnered with Frost Gaming or else they can file a complaint and ultimately get you in trouble. But even then, it's not like you're going to go to jail or anything. Usually when things like this occur, things are settled in person before settling it in court. In my case, I assume I would have to close down my site. -
Well that says it all. Plus, the ban list will only cause more rage on the forum. We already get 'why am I banned' threads, next we'll see I want my name removed because that was back in 2009...and let the stories begin!
I'm thinking of letting the IGNs expire after a year from the date posted. People do change for the better or worse (and so do their IGNs
). Not to mention, I've got limited storage space
What's different with my Banlist however is that it'll be able to determine exactly when there is suspicious behaviour. It'll be similar to how Dropcam flags movement in their monitoring systems. The only difference is that the "flags" will serve a different purpose and it probably won't be so fancy since I have yet to find out how these CFR files work
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You can use IGNs, linking to Z8 is questionable but honestly who cares, you can not use Z8Games logos.
It's not like the system will actually list banned cheaters, it'll list some people that someone thinks cheats.
CFR files only contain positioning data that the game itself interprets and draws out.
Your best bet is using the game as is, as a replay viewer, but with an overlay that analyzes the movements.
Keeping in mind that replays are absolutely awful at recording positions, recoil patterns and such, and does not contain keystrokes, so detecting norecoil or macroing is out. -
You can use IGNs, linking to Z8 is questionable but honestly who cares, you can not use Z8Games logos.
It's not like the system will actually list banned cheaters, it'll list some people that someone thinks cheats.
CFR files only contain positioning data that the game itself interprets and draws out.
Your best bet is using the game as is, as a replay viewer, but with an overlay that analyzes the movements.
Keeping in mind that replays are absolutely awful at recording positions, recoil patterns and such, and does not contain keystrokes, so detecting norecoil or macroing is out.
True dat, not to mention you can't tell if it's no recoil cuz replay don't show the gun shaking when shooting, and also lag may interfere when detecting movement. -
You can use IGNs, linking to Z8 is questionable but honestly who cares, you can not use Z8Games logos.
It's not like the system will actually list banned cheaters, it'll list some people that someone thinks cheats.
CFR files only contain positioning data that the game itself interprets and draws out.
Your best bet is using the game as is, as a replay viewer, but with an overlay that analyzes the movements.
Keeping in mind that replays are absolutely awful at recording positions, recoil patterns and such, and does not contain keystrokes, so detecting norecoil or macroing is out.
Yeah. I've been noticing that problem too. Not to mention the quality of the CFR files decreases drastically with poor internet connection (for the user who saves the replay).
And thanks for the suggestion. I'll definitely consider it. That way I don't have to reverse engineer the CFR files and I can use something like OpenCV for the visual processing. I'll try this as a beginning stage and if I'm feeling real keen, then I'll go back to reverse engineering the CFR files. Honestly, analysing binary code is so boring and frustrating :mad:
And yeah, I'll get rid of all the Z8 logos and replace them with my own (not so good) logos. Or hopefully iKillzZ- helps me with them
EDIT: I just realized that visual processing is going to take forever and will also take up a lot of resources. So it looks like I'm going to have to go back into the hex editor....
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[MOD]Fizzeq wrote: »I believe I've already submitted a reply.
There was a ban list back in 2009, it was removed a few months later. Why? Because they felt it was pointless. They currently have a "ban result tool" available to the themselves, that's how I know that 20,000+ accounts were banned this month. As much as that goes, the list would never appear publicly for the general community.
For various reasons, it's not going to be shown. Your IGN and USN do belong under a trademark known as Smilegate. These accounts do not belong to you, who and why a player is banned is none of your business. If this was your game and you owned rights to it, you would be entitled to operate on such project under the proper resources (which you do not have permission for and own).
As all the reason that we know or not knowing to not posting it, one big reason to post it is to make the community confident that the banning system is working. It is far better to let the community to see either the numbers or the names than just telling them: "we are working hard to ban hackers", especially when it is said again and again but the number of hackers never decreases.
This is just a suggestion and is none of my business. And I believe even this list exists, it helps nothing to decrease the hackers.
A big side effect is that lots of players will question why this "ahm***" hacker is not in the list. This is something z8 do not want encounter but can not avoid.
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