How to help the competitive scene grow
I think most people would agree when I say that competitive Crossfire is in an interesting position right now. For a free to play game, it's come a pretty long way as far as the competitive scene goes - we've had multiple leagues, tournaments, draft organizations, cups, and more come and go, but we still have a miniscule and loose-knit community. These forums are basically dead, there's little competition, and teams come and go in a matter of days. However, at the same time, we have a promising future with the upcoming CSN and ESG leagues and WCG in november/december. The question is, what problems does the competitive community have, and what can be done to help solve them?
Attitude and Mentality
While I don't think this is the biggest problem we have in the grand scheme of things, I think it needs to be addressed first as it really irks me.As it stands right now, there's a very small amount of players and teams that enter the scene, and quite frankly, they have no reason to - the playerbase in general is uninviting and rude. Players and teams who have never touched a league or event in their CF careers spend more time trying to put people down than actually playing the game. This attitude doesn't help the competitive scene grow, and I don't understand why people have it. If players could simply focus more on playing, getting better, and building good relationships with people in the community, the competitive scene can grow larger and everyone will be much happier.
The Playerbase
We've all heard people say it a million times - this game is apparently "dead". In my opinion this is wrong, but it's not completely wrong. We're not dead yet in the sense that there still is a decent sized player base. I have no idea of any actual number of players in the competitive community, but people always seem to underestimate just how many players we have. In any case, I think this is the main issue with competitive CF. No one wants to sponsor CF teams or create leagues or tournaments because we simply don't have enough players. And on the flip side, no one wants to join the community because we don't have tournaments, leagues, or sponsored teams. I think that ESG, CSN, and WCG are a good start to helping increase the size of the community, but I think we could use more.
I don't know how possible this would be on G4Box and Z8's end, but I think an overhaul of the clan server and clans in general could do wonders for the competitive community. Right now, there are clans who play only clan wars in the clan server who "competitive players" would deem scrubs or pubstars. But when you think about it, these clans would probably be interested in more competition. If Z8/G4Box can fix the clan server's most glaring issues and give Echo 8 players a reason to play there, we can increase the pool of competitive players by a significant amount.
Now, the only problem with this idea is that the teams we have in Echo 8 for the most part are more skilled than the random clans in the clan server. Here is where a matchmaking system (similar to the one in League of Legends) could come into play.
Basically, instead of having rooms to join and having to wait for a team to join, a team leader would invite 4 other members into a lobby. When everyone is ready, the leader would press a button and the team of 5 gets placed into a pool with all the other teams who did the same. A team would have a certain rating, and would only get matched up with other teams who are near the same rating. A new team would start with a certain rating (1000 would be a good number), and each time they win or lose a match, they gain or lose an amount of rating, which could be based on # of rounds won and lost and the rating of the team that they faced.
What this system would do is allow teams to face teams their own skill level, which would mean that they don't play teams who are too easy for them (and in turn get bored), and that they don't play teams who are too hard for them (who would get no practice, and would get bored playing). They play the teams that they would benefit the most from playing.
The problems with the clan server
As I mentioned in the previous section, the clan server has some serious flaws that would need to be addressed in order for the matchmaking system to work.
The main problem with the clan server is that if a player disconnects or leaves from a clan server room, they are unable to get back in. This means that if a player's internet cuts out, or for some reason has to leave, his team is forced to play 4v5. If Z8/G4Box allows players to join back into the room, the player can either reconnect or the team can have a substitute from their teamcome in and play for the original player.
Another problem with the clan server is that there is no way to regulate weapons, items, and characters used by teams in the clan server. ZP characters, items, and weapons obviously have no place in competitive CF, and some GP weapons are considered overpowered and unfit for competitive CF by the community. If Z8/G4box created a way to select a certain ruleset in a clan server room (or before entering the matchmaking queue if the system were to be implemented), teams could play in a more competitive environment.
I'm a forgetful person, so let me know if I missed any other big issues with the clan server, because I'm sure I did.
The forums and the community outside of the game
If Z8/G4box were to combine the community inside of the game, they would be able to combine the community outside of the game as well. They could merge the competitive section and the clan sections into one larger subforum related to clans/clanwars in general. Here people could post guides, streams, and other related things dedicated to helping people improve their game in ways other than just playing. Mods could have an easier time regulating the trash talk and spam that we have in the current competitive section. Competitive players would have an overall better experience on the forums.
So there are my ideas for improving this game's competitive community - let me know what you guys think, give some feedback on my opinions, and feel free to share your own ideas.
Attitude and Mentality
While I don't think this is the biggest problem we have in the grand scheme of things, I think it needs to be addressed first as it really irks me.As it stands right now, there's a very small amount of players and teams that enter the scene, and quite frankly, they have no reason to - the playerbase in general is uninviting and rude. Players and teams who have never touched a league or event in their CF careers spend more time trying to put people down than actually playing the game. This attitude doesn't help the competitive scene grow, and I don't understand why people have it. If players could simply focus more on playing, getting better, and building good relationships with people in the community, the competitive scene can grow larger and everyone will be much happier.
The Playerbase
We've all heard people say it a million times - this game is apparently "dead". In my opinion this is wrong, but it's not completely wrong. We're not dead yet in the sense that there still is a decent sized player base. I have no idea of any actual number of players in the competitive community, but people always seem to underestimate just how many players we have. In any case, I think this is the main issue with competitive CF. No one wants to sponsor CF teams or create leagues or tournaments because we simply don't have enough players. And on the flip side, no one wants to join the community because we don't have tournaments, leagues, or sponsored teams. I think that ESG, CSN, and WCG are a good start to helping increase the size of the community, but I think we could use more.
I don't know how possible this would be on G4Box and Z8's end, but I think an overhaul of the clan server and clans in general could do wonders for the competitive community. Right now, there are clans who play only clan wars in the clan server who "competitive players" would deem scrubs or pubstars. But when you think about it, these clans would probably be interested in more competition. If Z8/G4Box can fix the clan server's most glaring issues and give Echo 8 players a reason to play there, we can increase the pool of competitive players by a significant amount.
Now, the only problem with this idea is that the teams we have in Echo 8 for the most part are more skilled than the random clans in the clan server. Here is where a matchmaking system (similar to the one in League of Legends) could come into play.
Basically, instead of having rooms to join and having to wait for a team to join, a team leader would invite 4 other members into a lobby. When everyone is ready, the leader would press a button and the team of 5 gets placed into a pool with all the other teams who did the same. A team would have a certain rating, and would only get matched up with other teams who are near the same rating. A new team would start with a certain rating (1000 would be a good number), and each time they win or lose a match, they gain or lose an amount of rating, which could be based on # of rounds won and lost and the rating of the team that they faced.
What this system would do is allow teams to face teams their own skill level, which would mean that they don't play teams who are too easy for them (and in turn get bored), and that they don't play teams who are too hard for them (who would get no practice, and would get bored playing). They play the teams that they would benefit the most from playing.
The problems with the clan server
As I mentioned in the previous section, the clan server has some serious flaws that would need to be addressed in order for the matchmaking system to work.
The main problem with the clan server is that if a player disconnects or leaves from a clan server room, they are unable to get back in. This means that if a player's internet cuts out, or for some reason has to leave, his team is forced to play 4v5. If Z8/G4Box allows players to join back into the room, the player can either reconnect or the team can have a substitute from their teamcome in and play for the original player.
Another problem with the clan server is that there is no way to regulate weapons, items, and characters used by teams in the clan server. ZP characters, items, and weapons obviously have no place in competitive CF, and some GP weapons are considered overpowered and unfit for competitive CF by the community. If Z8/G4box created a way to select a certain ruleset in a clan server room (or before entering the matchmaking queue if the system were to be implemented), teams could play in a more competitive environment.
I'm a forgetful person, so let me know if I missed any other big issues with the clan server, because I'm sure I did.
The forums and the community outside of the game
If Z8/G4box were to combine the community inside of the game, they would be able to combine the community outside of the game as well. They could merge the competitive section and the clan sections into one larger subforum related to clans/clanwars in general. Here people could post guides, streams, and other related things dedicated to helping people improve their game in ways other than just playing. Mods could have an easier time regulating the trash talk and spam that we have in the current competitive section. Competitive players would have an overall better experience on the forums.
So there are my ideas for improving this game's competitive community - let me know what you guys think, give some feedback on my opinions, and feel free to share your own ideas.
Comments
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Attitude and Mentality
While I don't think this is the biggest problem we have in the grand scheme of things, I think it needs to be addressed first as it really irks me.As it stands right now, there's a very small amount of players and teams that enter the scene, and quite frankly, they have no reason to - the playerbase in general is uninviting and rude. Players and teams who have never touched a league or event in their CF careers spend more time trying to put people down than actually playing the game. This attitude doesn't help the competitive scene grow, and I don't understand why people have it. If players could simply focus more on playing, getting better, and building good relationships with people in the community, the competitive scene can grow larger and everyone will be much happier.
you guys think, give some feedback on my opinions, and feel free to share your own ideas.
Good luck. you'll need it. -
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No to absolutely anything in the clan server. In case you've forgotten the clan server is what killed the first competitive community in this game. Any game that has a matchmaking system in play for competitive teams has failed. (LoL competitive teams are like us, only play in it when they are bored.) Match making has been attempted in Call Of duty, Csgo, and ava. All failed.
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Dag this is awesomeness
GJ!
Another thing I would like to state is that this game lacks sportsmanship in the competitive field, people who have barely touched the game (people who have started playing within a year) seem to be the ones who talk more "smack" over everything is just a bunch of nonsense, talking smack is only fun sometimes but not everytime
. It would be nice to have good sportsmanship every once in a while, I think it would bring more people to come into the competitive community which would be nice because there are only lets say 8 main teams in E8, it would be nice to have new faces instead of just the same people everyday.
Another thing that comes into play is that the ruleset that has been set and E8's reputation for being the "competitive" server/channel of the game. It would be nice to have "fair play," such as no special CHAR (SPOP, STAR, UNSF, SIA, GSG9, NAVY SEAL) and no weapons that are considered overpowered (wall damage weaps etc.) not hating on anybody that uses these things, but it would bring the competitive part of the game back from the dead as some people say. Also people get so "butthurt" over what others say over the internet, its just a game and have fun with it, don't take everything so seriously unless you know the person "trolling" you is just playing -
I see nothing wrong with smack talking. It's happened since day one of cs1.5 and has never stopped. Also it's not like esports is the only place where this happens. I've smack talked in football, basketball, hockey, and baseball and all of those sports seem to be pretty big.Dag this is awesomeness GJ!
Another thing I would like to state is that this game lacks sportsmanship in the competitive field, people who have barely touched the game (people who have started playing within a year) seem to be the ones who talk more "smack" over everything is just a bunch of nonsense. It would be nice to have good sportsmanship every once in a while, I think it would bring more people to come into the competitive community which would be nice because there are only lets say 8 main teams in E8, it would be nice to have new faces instead of just the same people everyday.
An actual thing that should be brought up here is the fact that people are no longer following the "rules" we have setup. Every scrim I see half the people running around with Flash guards, wide grenades, smiley grenades, and all sorts of other wacky stuff. This is the kind of stuff that actually kills this game. It started with the spop and the clan server, and we all know how that went. People should start acting like they care and take all that stuff off. I mean even one of the top teams had erick running around with armor, smoke goggles, flash guard and that bronze nade.
So if we want this game to become competitive start enforcing those rules again. -
Agreed, smack talking comes with sportsmanship, the only bad thing is that people take it a little too far and it gets annoying and then the people who take that sh*t seriously are just ignorant, easy solution.. just ignore itI see nothing wrong with smack talking. It's happened since day one of cs1.5 and has never stopped. Also it's not like esports is the only place where this happens. I've smack talked in football, basketball, hockey, and baseball and all of those sports seem to be pretty big.
An actual thing that should be brought up here is the fact that people are no longer following the "rules" we have setup. Every scrim I see half the people running around with Flash guards, wide grenades, smiley grenades, and all sorts of other wacky stuff. This is the kind of stuff that actually kills this game. It started with the spop and the clan server, and we all know how that went. People should start acting like they care and take all that stuff off. I mean even one of the top teams had erick running around with armor, smoke goggles, flash guard and that bronze nade.
So if we want this game to become competitive start enforcing those rules again.
And I remember the old days also LOL (SPOP and Scar L etc.) enforcing rules would be nice and being able to setup rooms that have custom settings would be awesome, just something to bring up to Z8/G4Box, it would make the competitive field a lot more entertaining and fair -
Dag this is awesomeness GJ!
Another thing I would like to state is that this game lacks sportsmanship in the competitive field, people who have barely touched the game (people who have started playing within a year) seem to be the ones who talk more "smack" over everything is just a bunch of nonsense, talking smack is only fun sometimes but not everytime. It would be nice to have good sportsmanship every once in a while, I think it would bring more people to come into the competitive community which would be nice because there are only lets say 8 main teams in E8, it would be nice to have new faces instead of just the same people everyday.
Another thing that comes into play is that the ruleset that has been set and E8's reputation for being the "competitive" server/channel of the game. It would be nice to have "fair play," such as no special CHAR (SPOP, STAR, UNSF, SIA, GSG9, NAVY SEAL) and no weapons that are considered overpowered (wall damage weaps etc.) not hating on anybody that uses these things, but it would bring the competitive part of the game back from the dead as some people say. Also people get so "butthurt" over what others say over the internet, its just a game and have fun with it, don't take everything so seriously unless you know the person "trolling" you is just playing
Trash talk is fine with me as long as you keep it in-game. Posting it on the forums makes you look bad, and makes the community as a whole look bad.
As far as your second paragraph goes, if we had a decent pug vent/mumble/system, no one would have to worry about what people use in echo 8 pubs. They'd just play the pugs and have a competitive ruleset.
@Ryangi - Like I said, trash talk is fine, just keep it in-game. Be respectful to new players and people on the forums.
And yeah, if the clan server had a ruleset function, and wasn't broken, it would fix the problem of not following the rules. This is why I would really like to see an overhaul of the clan server. -
FGvirulent wrote: »The attitude of players in this game is appalling. As a new player you are automatically vilified and hated for no reason at all. The player base can't grow if new players can't play without getting harassed. I don't get why people expect Z8Games to help out with leagues and host tournaments when people are ungrateful and post nothing but negative things like the post above mine.
Hmm? They don't care though. They let the e8 glitch go on forever, just 1 of many random examples.
Truth fuuuucking hurts doesn't it? Z8 only cares about money, like any other company. It's not a game made for the competitive community. Get over yourself. -
FGvirulent wrote: »Because previously hosted tournaments by Z8 and them supporting other competitive tournaments is "not caring". You realize that they aren't responsible for patches right? Take it up with smilegate.
I know they aren't. But they didn't push for a fix either.
Sure they've sponsored a few, but compared to other 'competitive' games you could be playing, this is nothing at all dude. We don't even have a solid league. Mini cups is all. Lets give ZP/ZPitems to 'competitive' players! You're an idiot.
Also, just throwing it out there, remember how EVERYONE wanted ESG? and a/c? Then Sheep gets banned for trying to use cheats, and the community rejects it? Lmfao, not a competitive game, nor community. -
sukodaworst wrote: »Nothing will happen.
Z8 cares about pubstars, not a 'competitive community'.
$$$ means everything to them. It's why they won't get rid of the BRs, they are all selfish ugly fuuuucks.
Like any company, Z8 is not going to do some sort of large update just to satisfy the competitive community, which makes up 2% of the CF playerbase. The clan server has been needing an overhaul for a long time, and it would satisfy everyone who plays the game, not just the competitive community.
And getting rid of the BRs? Really? That has nothing to do with what we're talking about. Getting rid of the BRs would be devastating for Z8, because they make up most of the players in CF... -
sukodaworst wrote: »Hmm? They don't care though. They let the e8 glitch go on forever, just 1 of many random examples.
Truth fuuuucking hurts doesn't it? Z8 only cares about money, like any other company. It's not a game made for the competitive community. Get over yourself.
A harmless glitch that is really nothing more than a tiny annoyance doesn't take very much priority.
Games usually aren't made for competitive communities. The community makes the game what it is. -
A harmless glitch that is really nothing more than a tiny annoyance doesn't take very much priority.
Games usually aren't made for competitive communities. The community makes the game what it is.
True. But still, my comments aren't negative. I'm coming up front with the truth, my bad. -
Another problem with the clan server is that there is no way to regulate weapons, items, and characters used by teams in the clan server. ZP characters, items, and weapons obviously have no place in competitive CF, and some GP weapons are considered overpowered and unfit for competitive CF by the community. If Z8/G4box created a way to select a certain ruleset in a clan server room (or before entering the matchmaking queue if the system were to be implemented), teams could play in a more competitive environment.
This was our communities personal preference. Personally, I wish all items were allowed in competitive play. I believe it makes the game more balanced. For reference look to the other versions, namely china/vietnam. -
doophwaiting wrote: »This was our communities personal preference. Personally, I wish all items were allowed in competitive play. I believe it makes the game more balanced. For reference look to the other versions, namely china/vietnam.
I'd like to at the very least see all GP weapons allowed. It's always been my preference, but I don't think there would ever be any way to get people to support all items being allowed. I think that having more guns brings more variety into the game and more strategy (for example, do i pick a scar light / m4 for low recoil fast speed etc or an xm8 / g36 for wallbang or a m4-s/a for the silencer?). Unfortunately people in this community don't respond well to logic and are pretty set on the rules we have now. So if we're going to have rules, we might as well have a way to enforce them. -
I don't see anything wrong with silenced M4's doesn't put anyone at a disadvantage IMOI'd like to at the very least see all GP weapons allowed. It's always been my preference, but I don't think there would ever be any way to get people to support all items being allowed. I think that having more guns brings more variety into the game and more strategy (for example, do i pick a scar light / m4 for low recoil fast speed etc or an xm8 / g36 for wallbang or a m4-s/a for the silencer?). Unfortunately people in this community don't respond well to logic and are pretty set on the rules we have now. So if we're going to have rules, we might as well have a way to enforce them. -
All they need is an option within the room to restrict all ZP weapons, or the other way to go would be to allow everything except armor and spop/stars into the competitive scene like doop said. As for the clan server, maybe they should code it so only the player who got d/c can join back in the second half. Plus there's so many cheaters in clan server nowadays, it's pointless playing there
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i think one of the main issues with the community is that no one can take a bit of trash talk.. we're not talking anything major, but if you look in ANY sport, it is very common. the difference is, that after the game is over, people cant just "shake hands" and realize it was all just the game, and it wasnt personal. if the community could realize this, we'd have a very competitive community, with players respecting one another.
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i imagine the 'rejoin to respawn within the same round' issue is cause for some unwillingness to enable rejoining on clan server.
would be very difficult to do without opening up this potential for abuse.
you missed round time, or maybe its just me thinking they're ridiculously long.
(this might have been fixed already, haven't been on clan server in a year)
@guy " ffs z8 only cares about people who buyes zp "
becoming a solid name in the esport-scene is a goldmine for a first person shooter, they have every reason to take it seriously - even if some users don't buy ZP.
of course, most competitive players already get zp one way or another, which of course means money spent, so i'm not sure where you're coming from with this. -
pwnage2forum wrote: »All they need is an option within the room to restrict all ZP weapons, or the other way to go would be to allow everything except armor and spop/stars into the competitive scene like doop said.
Why not allow spop/stars and armor? China does it and they have the largest community and the reigning #1 team for over 3 years. -
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All of the zp weapons and armor and all that can potentially be "competitive," but there is always the fact that the people who are willing to pay actual money would have an advantage over those who don't. Unless ZP is just given out to all the competitive players, I don't really see a fair way about it.
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No to absolutely anything in the clan server. In case you've forgotten the clan server is what killed the first competitive community in this game. Any game that has a matchmaking system in play for competitive teams has failed. (LoL competitive teams are like us, only play in it when they are bored.) Match making has been attempted in Call Of duty, Csgo, and ava. All failed.
Not trying to troll, but I think it worked fine in Halo 3. Although halo is nothing like COD, Csgo, and ava. -
All of the zp weapons and armor and all that can potentially be "competitive," but there is always the fact that the people who are willing to pay actual money would have an advantage over those who don't. Unless ZP is just given out to all the competitive players, I don't really see a fair way about it.
Surveys . -
In case you've forgotten the clan server is what killed the first competitive community in this game.
???????
Anyway I imagine AVA failed because it wasn't a good game, not because of matchmaking, and I don't see how CS:GO has failed when it hasn't even had it's official release yet.
Clan server would simply increase the amount of teams/clans playing.
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