I suggest a change
So after reading this very abusive agreement that each and every one on here has agreed to, I would like GM Saidin for a change. Since you aren't technically breaking the terms and conditions on the discussion of "other games", can it be made so that players can make a thread on the Off topic to find away to play together in other games and not only CF or Metin2?
I am completely aware that you guys can do anything you want if you feel that it is in the harm of the company, but I would like to question if its really a harm to the company. If the other game isn't necessarily a competitor in the same arena of gaming (free first person shooter), is it really a danger to ,for example, make a thread asking if members of the game would like to play a custom LoL match?
Is it really going to take away from revenue? Or does it facilitate communal growth and allow for people to come into the community as a group? If you can satisfy that group, then you get revenue right? Wouldn't it be better to accept than to shun?
Also, which has the higher ground...
This:
http://www.z8games.com/termsandcondition.aspx
or This:
http://forum.z8games.com/showthread.php?t=19
"Please do not ask for or provide links to other regions' Cross Fire games, or of any other competitors games. Please do not post videos or screens from other versions; there is plenty of other topics on these already and new ones will be removed or closed."
IF you so kindly define what a "competitor game" is, then it would be out of the Mods hands to rule on their own accord and/or bias.
I am completely aware that you guys can do anything you want if you feel that it is in the harm of the company, but I would like to question if its really a harm to the company. If the other game isn't necessarily a competitor in the same arena of gaming (free first person shooter), is it really a danger to ,for example, make a thread asking if members of the game would like to play a custom LoL match?
Is it really going to take away from revenue? Or does it facilitate communal growth and allow for people to come into the community as a group? If you can satisfy that group, then you get revenue right? Wouldn't it be better to accept than to shun?
Also, which has the higher ground...
This:
http://www.z8games.com/termsandcondition.aspx
or This:
http://forum.z8games.com/showthread.php?t=19
"Please do not ask for or provide links to other regions' Cross Fire games, or of any other competitors games. Please do not post videos or screens from other versions; there is plenty of other topics on these already and new ones will be removed or closed."
IF you so kindly define what a "competitor game" is, then it would be out of the Mods hands to rule on their own accord and/or bias.
Comments
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Agreed. To be honest, I feel like only F2P FPS games shall not be discussed in here. For example a discussion about BFBC2 or S.T.A.L.K.E.R. shalln't be denied, simply because those are not competitors to CF.
Pay 2 Play ain't really a threat to Free 2 Play, since most of the people on Free 2 Play play because well ... Duh, it's free. -
Well why do you have to use the Cross Fire forums to talk about other games. Go on their forums. Use xfire, use facebook, heck.....even use the PM system. Fact of the matter is you want to use a particular games forum to talk about another ones. Revenue or not, it shouldnt be happening.
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Guys, you don't know to many about marketing, do you?
Even if you are talking about Barbie and the butterflies Online, you are doing something "illegal".
Barbie and the butterflies Online is not a FPS, but it's a competitor for Cross Fire. Why ? Because it can attract Cross Fire's customers.
Barbie and the butterflies Online is an indirect competitor for Cross Fire, but still a competitor.
Note: Barbie and the butterflies Online is not a real game. (I hope )
Sorry for interfering, I'll go back to M2 forums. QQ -
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[MOD]Iceman wrote: »Well why do you have to use the Cross Fire forums to talk about other games. Go on their forums. Use xfire, use facebook, heck.....even use the PM system. Fact of the matter is you want to use a particular games forum to talk about another ones. Revenue or not, it shouldnt be happening.
I don't see why it can't be done. Its more of a hassle to find each and every person of this community and ask them to join, as opposed to making one thread to which you can invite people and then play. Many of whom probably play that game already and are also trying to find groups of people to play with instead of trying to find random people and making a primitive team with people you don't even remotely know (of course this is the internet, but you know what I mean).
Why shouldn't it be happening? As far as I can tell, the rules don't specify, and if you really want to get legal, we can take that route too.for a guy who claims to not care / not play the game you sure waste your life on it.
btw didn't even read a word of what you wrote
Quote me please. Nice attempt though.[MOD]Boschi wrote: »Guys, you don't know to many about marketing, do you?
Even if you are talking about Barbie and the butterflies Online, you are doing something "illegal".
Barbie and the butterflies Online is not a FPS, but it's a competitor for Cross Fire. Why ? Because it can attract Cross Fire's customers.
Barbie and the butterflies Online is an indirect competitor for Cross Fire, but still a competitor.
Note: Barbie and the butterflies Online is not a real game. (I hope )
Sorry for interfering, I'll go back to M2 forums. QQ
I think I would like to kindly ask for you to go back and click the link that I provided and see if it doesn't imply that its referencing free first person shooters.
To say that something as different as Barbie is a competitor is like saying that the ESPN link is a competitor because it can potentially take away from customers. If thats the case, then nothing can pretty much be spoken of in the Off topic.
It would just be nice for a person of higher authority, a GM perhaps, to finally settle this or set the predicate by defining what a "competitor" is. -
Well, if we are going to be technical; here is the full gist of the rules and any conflicting issues you may have;
http://forum.z8games.com/showthread.php?t=19The Following is a list of all the current forum rules that must be followed by all members and visitors also the entire forum is governed by the Code of Conduct and the Terms and Conditions. Be sure to read them and follow them or appropriate actions will be taken.
(Note the comma to separate the games and products difference.)No advertising other games, products in a promotional/spam behavior (including links within the post message, signature or promotional image on avatar)
(This is in addition to the general rules noted above.)Cross Fire Specific Forum Rules:
Please do not ask for or provide links to other regions' Cross Fire games, or of any other competitors games. Please do not post videos or screens from other versions; there is plenty of other topics on these already and new ones will be removed or closed.
Now the very first quote for you easily spelled out that the TOS and the forum rules are not separate entities but are in fact linked together, noted by an official Z8 representative.
The no advertising other games is quite plainly spelled out. Different genres according to this rule do not circumvent it as there was no specification such exceptions were to exist. Therefore it includes all.
Just stating what it says. Leaving my opinion out of it. -
The topic has been discussed and been answered by GM's on multiple occasions.
While Boschi was a little extreme with his example he is correct, it's just bad marketing sense to allow group discussion and encouragement of other games on a forum devoted to a specific one. Do you think Blizzard would allow for discussion of Valve games on their boards? Or vice versa? I think not. (Though I haven't been to either so feel free to correct me on that.)
They tolerate some talk within reason, so I don't really see anything worth complaining about. -
Boschi, Talon's, and Maven's responses make sense.
ToS is technically larger in authority, but also broader... hence the use of forum rules to help specify that power onto a portion of the Z8Games website, the forums.
And really... why bother using this forum to discuss other games that more than likely have their own forums... or even to use 3rd party chatting programs like AIM or Xfire or even the Steam chat (idk where I'm going there)?
Cool thread Rawr, subscribin to this for a future reference. -
Its not that I'm complaining, cus I could care less if it doenst go the way I would like it to, but its just less of a pain. I would rather to continue posting on this website and then play with the same people that I have had discussions with.
And thats what I mean Talon, how is it promoting if you are just asking other people if they would like to hop onto a different game for a little bit to play another game, and then go back to playing CF?
I would understand why if I made a thread like "CF sucks nuts and we should go to LoL" or something to get closed, but why should a "Hey guys, would anyone like to play some LoL for a bit?" be a promotional one? You are just asking if you would like to play with others. Plus, its not like the people that already spend money on CF aren't going to just be like "Oh my god, I'm gonna quit and stop buying ZP". Its possible, but highly unlikely, especially if its just a temporary change in games.
Its not like everyone on here ONLY plays CF anyway. Wouldn't it be nice to play with the same people though (instead of going on each person that might play with you and sending them a pm hoping that they will respond to you?... Oh and lets not forget how much more of a hassle it would be to tell each and one of those people that do say yes the ts3, vent, or mumble info to speak with you). -
Technically advertising is promoting it and vice versa. Asking others to play such a game is technically promotion, even if its at its lowest form. Word of mouth. Discussing such is also a form of promotion, cuz lets be honest, how can one talk about a game and not say anything about its features or how great/terrible it is?
Granted, I would like to see the rule changed a bit to be a bit more accepting in such a fashion for certain cases. However with RAW (rules as written) there are currently no exceptions.
The rivalry of promotion through businesses have been laid out since they were created, because of that. Word of mouth is quite powerful in numbers. It's proven such throughout history. So I can see why they have such a rule. It injures business. Which no company wants. No matter who they are. -
I can't post the actual truth here, so here is a new response.
"Is it really going to take away from revenue? Or does it facilitate communal growth and allow for people to come into the community as a group? If you can satisfy that group, then you get revenue right? Wouldn't it be better to accept than to shun?"
Yes, it could take away from revenue, which is what this company desires most. Everything that you read in that agreement is put there keeping the best intentions of the company in mind - not yours. Also, communal growth is a farce compared to the loads of ZP buyers coming in. In they end they can still shun all they please and still have the leeway to get away with it. Business ethics anyone? -
[MOD]Talonblaze wrote: »Technically advertising is promoting it and vice versa. Asking others to play such a game is technically promotion, even if its at its lowest form. Word of mouth. Discussing such is also a form of promotion, cuz lets be honest, how can one talk about a game and not say anything about its features or how great/terrible it is?
Granted, I would like to see the rule changed a bit to be a bit more accepting in such a fashion for certain cases. However with RAW (rules as written) there are currently no exceptions.
The rivalry of promotion through businesses have been laid out since they were created, because of that. Word of mouth is quite powerful in numbers. It's proven such throughout history. So I can see why they have such a rule. It injures business. Which no company wants. No matter who they are.
Um... yeah Advertising is promoting... I don't understand why you posted that but ok...
You say that discussing other games is a form of promotion then why are there countless "What game should I buy next" and "Greatest games of all time" threads all over the place? Those threads explicitly do that and several Mods and used to be Mods post there fav games of all time? Is it me or do I see some discrepancies? ( I can see you editing posts off of it right now Talon).
You see it as injuring, but what is to say that people in that same group wont take people from that game to this game? Most of the people here, like I said previously, aren't going to put their hands up and quit this game (despite the hundreds of "I quit" threads which end up being attention seeking ones, but thats another story).
I'm not making a "GET RID OF THE RULE" thread. All I'm asking is for some leeway in playing with other people. People used to do "Forum room" in the barracks... what is to say that the same can't be done in the Off topic? -
I don't have much time atm to answer though I would, I just want to let you know you most likely won't get a response from Saidin right now because he's busy over with WCG.
So don't take it personally if he doesn't respond, he's just busy atm with WCG. However one thing I know he'd mention and I'll put it out is just like any other f2p gaming forum, they won't let you do it either. Riot is a perfect example and one he likes to use, they won't let you talk about games like CF on their forums. There's a fine line on which games you can, but in most cases, just there's plenty of other ways, including forums meant for those games. If you're looking for people you know to play with, you have other means of contact, if you're looking for just anyone, than other forums work just as great.
As to the "Forum Room", that's for a Z8Games game, CrossFire. So of course it's allowed. Just because this is off topic doesnt mean everything is allowed.
Anyway, I need to go, just wanted to post a little something.
![[MOD]Rex](https://z8games.akamaized.net/cfna/forum/customavatars/68/navatar_3617368.gif){kind=avatar}
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