High-rank gun [AA-12 shotgun]
Comments
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...TurksAreUgly wrote: »
The Auto Assault-12 (AA-12), originally designed and known as the Atchisson Assault Shotgun, is a shotgun developed in 1972 by Maxwell Atchisson. The current 2005 version has been developed over 18 years since the patent was sold to Military Police Systems, Inc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyIhJKWSl6k - Check this youtube link for the sugestion
Make it for captain grade 8s only and you got a +1 -
No it's not. Twice as slow as an assault rifle, if we take 600 RPM as an average. It's like if you said that one bottle of vodka is pretty close to two bottles of vodka.Compared to a bottle of water, 1 bottle of vodka is a lot closer to 2 bottles of vodka. And a full automatic shotgun with a 300 RPM is a lot closer to and assault rifle with an average 600 RPM, then it is to a semi automatic shotgun that is limited by how fast you can pull the trigger.
Heck, its comparing a SUV to a sports car and a bicycle. You do the math.
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You make no sence. If a = 1 and b = 2, the difference is one a. In this case, it's the same thing. The difference is as huge as having two AA-12 (in wich case 300 x 2 = 600 = Average rifle RPM). I never opposed you before, because you did made sence, but not this time.Compared to a bottle of water, 1 bottle of vodka is a lot closer to 2 bottles of vodka. And a full automatic shotgun with a 300 RPM is a lot closer to and assault rifle with an average 600 RPM, then it is to a semi automatic shotgun that is limited by how fast you can pull the trigger.
Heck, its comparing a SUV to a sports car and a bicycle. You do the math.
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Done the math for you.
I do my homework. Unlike some I could name.
Oh, and also, this is just the average right? If you compare that ROF to a G36K or Tar-21, than the difference will be even GREATER than twice AA-12. -
TurksAreUgly wrote: »
The Auto Assault-12 (AA-12), originally designed and known as the Atchisson Assault Shotgun, is a shotgun developed in 1972 by Maxwell Atchisson. The current 2005 version has been developed over 18 years since the patent was sold to Military Police Systems, Inc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyIhJKWSl6k - Check this youtube link for the sugestion
That would be the funniest gun ever
but it would be a zp crate.....which would be a horrible fail...play killing floor if you like that gun so much fun!!! makes me wanna play it right now -
They need a fully automatic combat shotgun in this game. The damage-range drop-off and and amount of shells in each attack would be the main limiting factors of the weapon. Modifying those two characteristics could make or brake this gun.
Also, frecklez, don't try to do math or justify false logic on here again...like ever? -
You make no sence. If a = 1 and b = 2, the difference is one a. In this case, it's the same thing. The difference is as huge as having two AA-12 (in wich case 300 x 2 = 600 = Average rifle RPM). I never opposed you before, because you did made sence, but not this time.
Done the math for you.
I do my homework. Unlike some I could name.
Oh, and also, this is just the average right? If you compare that ROF to a G36K or Tar-21, than the difference will be even GREATER than twice AA-12.You calculation is correct, but the numbers you use are wrong. Sure the average assault rifle fires at twice the full automatic speed as the AA-12, but the average shotgun is not full automatic at all.
Like I said, its comparing and SUV (AA-12) with a race car (average assault rifle) and a bicycle (average shotgun). The race car will go twice as fast as the SUV, but with both you only have to turn the engine on and put a foot on the gas peddle, while the bicycle will only go as fast as you can peddle.
I'm not talking about game mechanics here, where even the semi-automatic rifles fire automatically. No, I'm talking about real life mechanics, where semi-automatic rifles and shotguns have a RPM of 0
And 300 RPM is closer to the 500 to 700 RPM (not talking about the average 600, but about RPM range between which most rifles are considered assault rifles.) than it is to 0 RPM (the number for all none or semi-automatic rifles)
Does this make more sense to you?
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xtrapfever wrote: »you really need a man in your life. this is painfully sadI'm married, thank you very much. And he's more man than you'll ever be, punk.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops -
I'm married, thank you very much. And he's more man than you'll ever be, punk.
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hahahaha. yeah he must be great. adult women spending 5 hours everyday on a kids game forum arguing about guns. -
xtrapfever wrote: »hahahaha. yeah he must be great. adult women spending 5 hours everyday on a kids game forum arguing about guns.1. I don't spend 5 hours a day on this forum. I just log in to check up several times a day.
2. Just because 13 year olds are allowed to playing this game, doesn't mean it is only meant for them.
3. There is a difference between arguing and talking passionately about a subject to get a point across.
4. My social life is of no business to a punk like you, nor is it part of this game. So I ask you kindly to refrain from making it a topic of discussion.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops -
You calculation is correct, but the numbers you use are wrong. Sure the average assault rifle fires at twice the full automatic speed as the AA-12, but the average shotgun is not full automatic at all.
Like I said, its comparing and SUV (AA-12) with a race car (average assault rifle) and a bicycle (average shotgun). The race car will go twice as fast as the SUV, but with both you only have to turn the engine on and put a foot on the gas peddle, while the bicycle will only go as fast as you can peddle.
I'm not talking about game mechanics here, where even the semi-automatic rifles fire automatically. No, I'm talking about real life mechanics, where semi-automatic rifles and shotguns have a RPM of 0
And 300 RPM is closer to the 500 to 700 RPM (not talking about the average 600, but about RPM range between which most rifles are considered assault rifles.) than it is to 0 RPM (the number for all none or semi-automatic rifles)
Does this make more sense to you?
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It does, thanks a lot. But what you said right there, is that the AA-12 is neatly supperior to any shotgun, what it basically is supposed to be. Going from that angle, I don't see where is the problem for the next few reasons:
- The shotgun using comminity is pretty small in this game (exept maybe the XM1014-Adv and sometimes GM and Egypt players). Bringing this gun in, will step this community up.
- While being supperior to most if not all shotguns, this gun will still be dominated at medium, long and sniper ranges (Medium defined as across egypt, long defined as across TD monaco, sniper defined as from A DesertStorm to the walkway leadint to
, once again no problem here.
- And last but not least, it's amazing rank requirement (wich shall ofcourse be not lower than 2nd LT at least) wich will have only experienced people (or eventually farmers) using this weapon. I believe it's price will be somewhat prohibiting the usage of this gun too (at least 70K GP).xtrapfever wrote: »hahahaha. yeah he must be great. adult women spending 5 hours everyday on a kids game forum arguing about guns.1. I don't spend 5 hours a day on this forum. I just log in to check up several times a day.
2. Just because 13 year olds are allowed to playing this game, doesn't mean it is only meant for them.
3. There is a difference between arguing and talking passionately about a subject to get a point across.
4. My social life is of no business to a punk like you, nor is it part of this game. So I ask you kindly to refrain from making it a topic of discussion.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops
Look, I know you're in the middle of an argument, but could you two please follow up with this in PM? Thanks. -
Pancor Jackhammer = OP
Pancor rate of fire < AA12 rate of fire
Pancor recoil > AA12 recoil (lower than a lot of other weapons on CF).
Pancor power = AA12 power.
AA12 > OP
I might sound a bit harsh, but this is a gun that should never be introduced to ANY FPS game. No, not even COD or Battlefield.
I don't play Warrock because it's obvious that their free weapons (weapons not requiring IRL money) are nowhere near as good as their purchasable weapons (purchased with IRL money). Some of their purchasable weapons have the exact firing rate, spray pattern, reload, and recoil as free guns, but noticeably more power. -
How is a shotgun OP at Medium to Sniper range if it's got dispertion? Yeah, think about this one Watson.Pancor Jackhammer = OP
Pancor rate of fire < AA12 rate of fire
Pancor recoil > AA12 recoil (lower than a lot of other weapons on CF).
Pancor power = AA12 power.
AA12 > OP
I might sound a bit harsh, but this is a gun that should never be introduced to ANY FPS game. No, not even COD or Battlefield.
I don't play Warrock because it's obvious that their free weapons (weapons not requiring IRL money) are nowhere near as good as their purchasable weapons (purchased with IRL money). Some of their purchasable weapons have the exact firing rate, spray pattern, reload, and recoil as free guns, but noticeably more power.
And to those of you who think that shotguns are overpowered in close range ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RP4FjODPDFA&feature=related
Here. Replace the mannequins by you. Shotguns are SUPPOSED to kill you at closerange with nothing standing in their way. -
Pancor Jackhammer = OP
Pancor rate of fire < AA12 rate of fire
Pancor recoil > AA12 recoil (lower than a lot of other weapons on CF).
Pancor power = AA12 power.
AA12 > OP
I might sound a bit harsh, but this is a gun that should never be introduced to ANY FPS game. No, not even COD or Battlefield.
I don't play Warrock because it's obvious that their free weapons (weapons not requiring IRL money) are nowhere near as good as their purchasable weapons (purchased with IRL money). Some of their purchasable weapons have the exact firing rate, spray pattern, reload, and recoil as free guns, but noticeably more power.
The AA12 isnt OP. when in close range it should be expected for a 1-2 shot kill, afterall it IS a shotgun. -
I'm married, thank you very much. And he's more man than you'll ever be, punk.
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pzpzpzpzppzpzp -
It does, thanks a lot. But what you said right there, is that the AA-12 is neatly supperior to any shotgun, what it basically is supposed to be. Going from that angle, I don't see where is the problem for the next few reasons:
- The shotgun using comminity is pretty small in this game (exept maybe the XM1014-Adv and sometimes GM and Egypt players). Bringing this gun in, will step this community up.
- While being supperior to most if not all shotguns, this gun will still be dominated at medium, long and sniper ranges (Medium defined as across egypt, long defined as across TD monaco, sniper defined as from A DesertStorm to the walkway leadint to, once again no problem here.
- And last but not least, it's amazing rank requirement (wich shall ofcourse be not lower than 2nd LT at least) wich will have only experienced people (or eventually farmers) using this weapon. I believe it's price will be somewhat prohibiting the usage of this gun too (at least 70K GP).And this is why I have a problem with this gun right here. In GM, there is no medium, long or sniper range for Black List players. Only melee range.
Have you ever tried bunny hopping around, trying to kill a guy who hides himself behind a wall of buckshot? Shotguns are the worst in this case, because of the spread of the weapon. At long range they don't do a lot of damage, true. But if your stuck with just a melee weapon, being detected is already lethal. The guy with the shotgun may not be able to kill you at long range. But the spread of the weapon covers such a large area, that at long range he has the advantage in finding you. Allowing other players with more accurate guns to kill you when they see the blood spatter of the 1 or 2 HP damage you took from getting hit by the shotgun.
Now comes along a guy holding an AA-12, who can cover a large area, thanks to the spread advantage of a shotgun, at half the speed of an assault rifle user.
A shotgun in GM has the advantage at long range in finding ghosts, and at close range in killing ghosts. The only disadvantage they have there, is fire and reload speed. A disadvantage the AA-12 doesn't have, because it fires at 300 RPM and used either 8 shell box magazines or 20 and 32 shell drums.
Even if the developers think up some crazy ass animation to slow down the reload time on the AA-12, its still going to be fully reloaded faster than lets say a XM1014, where you have to put the shells in one by one.
Also, this gun is likely to end up being a crate weapon of some sort, therefore will have no rank requirement.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops -
Fist of all, as a ghost you are not supposed to be detected in the first place. Taking down a shotgun user is as simple as not letting him know you are around in the first place. Of course, it takes skill to master bunnyhopping, but than again, why expecting to kill an ennemi if you don't have enough skill to stay out of his sight?And this is why I have a problem with this gun right here. In GM, there is no medium, long or sniper range for Black List players. Only melee range.
Have you ever tried bunny hopping around, trying to kill a guy who hides himself behind a wall of buckshot? Shotguns are the worst in this case, because of the spread of the weapon. At long range they don't do a lot of damage, true. But if your stuck with just a melee weapon, being detected is already lethal. The guy with the shotgun may not be able to kill you at long range. But the spread of the weapon covers such a large area, that at long range he has the advantage in finding you. Allowing other players with more accurate guns to kill you when they see the blood spatter of the 1 or 2 HP damage you took from getting hit by the shotgun.
Now comes along a guy holding an AA-12, who can cover a large area, thanks to the spread advantage of a shotgun, at half the speed of an assault rifle user.
A shotgun in GM has the advantage at long range in finding ghosts, and at close range in killing ghosts. The only disadvantage they have there, is fire and reload speed. A disadvantage the AA-12 doesn't have, because it fires at 300 RPM and used either 8 shell box magazines or 20 and 32 shell drums.
Even if the developers think up some crazy ass animation to slow down the reload time on the AA-12, its still going to be fully reloaded faster than lets say a XM1014, where you have to put the shells in one by one.
Also, this gun is likely to end up being a crate weapon of some sort, therefore will have no rank requirement.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops
Second, if I understand you correctly, you mean spraying will be fatal to ghosts. AND, spraying is the WORST possible mistake a GR team member can make, for it won't only disable him from hearing the ghosts around, but will do so for the entire team. Honestly, it's way easier to take down M12s/XM1014 sprayers than a silenced M4/MP5 user.
Of course, for ghosts who aren't able to bunnyhop, this gun is going to be a pain in the genital parts, but for the ghosts who are actually good at it (if I dare saying, I pretty much master bunnyhop so I'm one of those examples), this gun can be a HUGE advantage, allowing for silent approaches and assasination.
And last, but not least. Look at the GP crates. They require a sargeant rank to be able to buy and use them. Making this gun a ZP Crate exclusive to second of first LTs shalln't be any more complicated than having GP crates available only to sargeants and higher, making it exclusive to the most experienced players, or the most dedicated farmers. -
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Fist of all, as a ghost you are not supposed to be detected in the first place. Taking down a shotgun user is as simple as not letting him know you are around in the first place. Of course, it takes skill to master bunnyhopping, but than again, why expecting to kill an ennemi if you don't have enough skill to stay out of his sight?
Second, if I understand you correctly, you mean spraying will be fatal to ghosts. AND, spraying is the WORST possible mistake a GR team member can make, for it won't only disable him from hearing the ghosts around, but will do so for the entire team. Honestly, it's way easier to take down M12s/XM1014 sprayers than a silenced M4/MP5 user.
Of course, for ghosts who aren't able to bunnyhop, this gun is going to be a pain in the genital parts, but for the ghosts who are actually good at it (if I dare saying, I pretty much master bunnyhop so I'm one of those examples), this gun can be a HUGE advantage, allowing for silent approaches and assasination.
And last, but not least. Look at the GP crates. They require a sargeant rank to be able to buy and use them. Making this gun a ZP Crate exclusive to second of first LTs shalln't be any more complicated than having GP crates available only to sargeants and higher, making it exclusive to the most experienced players, or the most dedicated farmers.You fail to understand what I'm talking about here, which makes explaining my point extremely difficult.
But I'm not actually talking about the noob sprayers. I'm talking about pin pointers that start spraying a general direction as soon as they hear breathing. The sprayer that already knows you are there somewhere, but only needs to physically find you. The sprayer that fires at the defuser. The sprayer that sprays when needed.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops -
TurksAreUgly wrote: »
The Auto Assault-12 (AA-12), originally designed and known as the Atchisson Assault Shotgun, is a shotgun developed in 1972 by Maxwell Atchisson. The current 2005 version has been developed over 18 years since the patent was sold to Military Police Systems, Inc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyIhJKWSl6k - Check this youtube link for the sugestion
Too "OP" of a gun to be GP but with the ammo i think it'll work cuz the actually clip size is bigger -
Even those are very easy to take down, since you have to be mobile at all times. And when he starts spraying, that's when you're supposed to kill him. Also, there's such a simple thing as distraction. Ever tried to spam W + S?You fail to understand what I'm talking about here, which makes explaining my point extremely difficult.
But I'm not actually talking about the noob sprayers. I'm talking about pin pointers that start spraying a general direction as soon as they hear breathing. The sprayer that already knows you are there somewhere, but only needs to physically find you. The sprayer that fires at the defuser. The sprayer that sprays when needed.
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops -
Even those are very easy to take down, since you have to be mobile at all times. And when he starts spraying, that's when you're supposed to kill him. Also, there's such a simple thing as distraction. Ever tried to spam W + S?If it is all that easy, then why does most GM matches still consist out of 60% to 80% that can't do it, and start kick voting you out of the game when you can?
My Suggestions: Ak-47 Custom FN Five-seveN Custom Glock-18 Adv. M110 s.a.s.s. M4A1 Masterkey MAC 10 Suppressed XM110 Spec-ops
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